Low RSSI

General Help and support for the Taranis Radio.
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Re: Low RSSI

Post by sandyc » Fri Mar 14, 2014 1:37 pm

Thanks Kilrah, I`ve now had the opportunity to experiment with other Rx`s, and they don`t have this problem, but the PCB antennae do work much better when they are outside the fuselage. The original X8R I fitted with new antennae, and it works perfectly well, either with the plain co-ax wire type or the PCB. Indications therefore of faulty aerial. The PCB`s do show better RSSI numbers, but these are only a guide, as they vary wildly between 50 and 88, even at moderate distances. I still have doubts that the range is as much as the 1500m claimed, after my initial experience I will be very cautious in increasing the distance I allow the model to be away from my position.

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Re: Low RSSI

Post by PeterV » Tue Apr 01, 2014 12:07 am

Some of my planes give incessant warning as I fly around a 600m approx square field. For eg maybe doing circuits, or even figure eight, within that 600m maximum.
Some are X8R - they seem the worst.... some are D8R-II. I haven't test/proven it but it struck me that my D6FR planes have not done it at all... they are only in small sub-1000m planes, and probably three flown wit the Taranis.
With T9X and DJT (before) I never even had any RSSI 'beeps' ever really.

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Re: Low RSSI

Post by Rob Thomson » Tue Apr 01, 2014 7:59 am

Make that 400 maximum.

A 3m model is a dot at 400m. :)

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Re: Low RSSI

Post by bob195558 » Sun Jun 01, 2014 3:44 am

We all have become confident when using the FrSky DJT Transmitter Modules with the D8R-II Plus and D8R-XP Receivers.
I speculate the Internal XJT Transmitters together with the X8R Receivers using the Taranis OpenTX firmware may not be calibrated
and/or process the telemetry signal data in the same way as the well performing Rock Solid DJT Transmitters Modules,
together with the D8R-II Plus and D8R-XP Receivers using the er9x collections of firmwares.
MikeB wrote: The only thing left, I can think of, that is different between the DJT and the XJT is the TxD signal itself.
The DJT has a full RS232 driver, going -5 to +5 volts.
The XJT has a transistor that only goes from 0 to 3.3V.
Mike.
From Re: FrSky Telemetry with erSky9x, Question: (viewtopic.php?f=94&t=5349&start=60#p76535).
Is it possible to do a mod to the Taranis Radio, to bring a Telemetry Cable through the case, so to be able to use the external DJT Module with its Telemetry ?

Bob
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Re: Low RSSI

Post by bertrand35 » Sun Jun 01, 2014 9:33 am

Perhaps to the serial plug inside the battery bay, or you could modify the DJT so that it sends telemetry on the S.PORT pin?


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Re: Low RSSI

Post by MikeB » Sun Jun 01, 2014 9:49 am

If you mod the DJT, be sure to use the method using a schottky diode as well as resistors to avoid damage to the SPort circuitry in the Taranis.

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Re: Low RSSI

Post by bob195558 » Mon Jun 02, 2014 5:30 pm

Hi Mike,
I prefer not to mod the external DJT Module, but keep it stock, as we sometimes changing Transmitter Modules around to different Radios
and if a modified Module were used in a different Radio, it could cause damage.

I think its better for our small RC group to stay with bringing the Analog Telemetry Cable through the Taranis Radio Case to use the telemetry with the DJT Module.

Could you show the connections for the mod to use the external DJT module with the two Analog Telemetry Cable Wires from the Taranis Mainboard
that will go through the back Taranis Radio Case ?
100_5443.JPG
Inside Taranis Radio
Taranis Mainboard_4306.jpg
Taranis Mainboard

Bob
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Re: Low RSSI

Post by MikeB » Mon Jun 02, 2014 6:02 pm

The DJT module outputs full RS232 voltages. The only safe place to connect this to directly is the serial interface connector located in the battery bay.
At present, I don't think openTx supports this for telemetry input.

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Re: Low RSSI

Post by bob195558 » Mon Jun 02, 2014 6:23 pm

Hi Mike,

Could we use your ERSKY9X on Taranis (viewtopic.php?f=7&t=4582) and be able to do the mod ?

Bob :)
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Re: Low RSSI

Post by MikeB » Mon Jun 02, 2014 8:31 pm

A guarded yes.
I seem to have the code in place to receive telemetry. I don't remember testing it though!
I don't have code for sending the alarm setting to the DJT in place.

I'll see if I can run a test of this.

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Re: Low RSSI

Post by MikeB » Mon Jun 02, 2014 9:00 pm

Just tested it, seems to work fine for receiving telemetry.
I plugged in an un-modified DJT, wired the TxD signal to the receive pin of the connector in the battery bay (rightmost pin), and set the "FrSky COM port" to 2 in the TELEMETRY2 menu.
Bind to a D8R-II and I have RSSI and A1/A2 all working.

So it's just a matter of getting the one signal to that connector. If you don't use the earphone socket, you might be able to feed the wire through there. It would make sense to connect the data signal to the RxD of the DJT at the same time, that goes to the next pin along from the right of the connector in the battery bay.

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Re: Low RSSI

Post by bob195558 » Tue Jun 03, 2014 2:29 am

Hi Mike,

Thank You for adding this option to use the DJT with Telemetry in the Taranis! :D

I have a photo showing the TxD and RxD wiring connections to what I think you are saying.
Do I have the wiring connections correct ? :?:
TxD RxD connection to DJT.jpg
Temp Wiring to show the TxD and RxD wiring connections.
And with the Sky9x Radio there is a GND wire connected.
Dose the Taranis need the GND wire also ? :?:
The 9x Radio's with the 9x TelemetrEZ board do not use a GND wire.

I will think about options to run the Telemetry Cable wires.

Bob :D
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Re: Low RSSI

Post by MikeB » Tue Jun 03, 2014 8:27 am

That's the correct wiring.
GND will be common via the module pins.

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Re: Low RSSI

Post by bob195558 » Wed Jun 04, 2014 12:08 am

Hi Mike,

If we were to use the external XJT Module in the Taranis Radio, is the S.Port connected through Pin 5 of the module bay like it is with our Sky9x Radios ? :?:

Bob
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Re: Low RSSI

Post by Kilrah » Wed Jun 04, 2014 6:04 am

Yes, no modification needed.
Internal module needs to be off if you want to use telemetry from the external XJT, or they would step on each other.

Now the question is why as it's identical to the internal module :)

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Re: Low RSSI

Post by bob195558 » Wed Jun 04, 2014 12:09 pm

Hi Kilrah,
Is OpenTX firmware in the Taranis Radio fully capable to use the Telemetry with the external DJT Module ? :?:
100_6049.JPG
Taranis with Telemetry Cable to DJT Module Transmitter.
Kilrah wrote:Yes, no modification needed.
Internal module needs to be off if you want to use telemetry from the external XJT, or they would step on each other.
Now the question is why as it's identical to the internal module :)
Here some ideas to why I think its a good option to have:
1) Compare the RX-RSSI Signal Data between internal and external XJT Transmitters.
2) Compare using different antennas between Transmitters.
3) To help trouble shoot the possibility of a faulty internal XJT Transmitters.

There may be more good justifications to have this option.

Bob
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Re: Low RSSI

Post by Kilrah » Wed Jun 04, 2014 12:36 pm

bob195558 wrote:Hi Kilrah,
Is OpenTX firmware in the Taranis Radio fully capable to use the Telemetry with the external DJT Module ? :?:
In OpenTX 2.0 it is but from module pin 5, not from the battery bay connector. That may still change.

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Re: Low RSSI

Post by bob195558 » Wed Jun 04, 2014 2:35 pm

Hi Kilrah,

I think normally Pin 5 is for S.Port only and only works with the X8R Receiver family ? :?:
I think for the Analog TxD and RxD Telemetry to the DJT Module is not in Pin 5 ? :?:

I may not be understanding correctly, please clarify my understanding. :)

Bob
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Re: Low RSSI

Post by bob195558 » Wed Jun 04, 2014 3:56 pm

Hi Mike and Everyone,

I have made the analog Telemetry Cable for the Taranis and chose to drill a .125 diameter hole through the back case for this cable to pass through.
I decided to stay with the same way we do the 9x Radios when using the 9x TelemetrEZ boards.
100_6037.JPG
Analog TxD Brown wire and RxD Red Wire Telemetry Cable.
I used a left over Taranis Gimbals 3 Pin Plug to make the two wire connections in the Battery Bay.
Next I used a 12 inch servo cable and I found a 6 pin plug that I removed part of it to make it into a 5 Pin Plug and I plugged-up the top pin location for orientation,
so when plugging into the external DJT or XJT module it will always be correctly wired.
Battery Bay Analog TxD  RxD Telemetry Wires..jpg
Analog TxD and RxD Telemetry Wires in Battery Bay to external DJT Module.
Telemetry Cable inside Taranis Radio.jpg
Inside Taranis Radio showing Telemetry Cable.
Next, I need to install the erSky9x (Taranis) _ r204_x9d firmware (x9d_rom.bin) using eepskye to my Taranis Radio.

Bob
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Re: Low RSSI

Post by bob195558 » Sun Jul 20, 2014 11:06 pm

Hi,
It has been a few weeks since I have been able to get back to flashing erSky9X to my Taranis Radio.
I have something corrupt, on my desk top computer (Win7) so my Taranis Radio would not connect to it and/or also the USB Zadig 2.1.0 Driver fail to install.
I was able to install the Zadig Driver to my notebook and my Taranis Radio has connected to it.
Using eepSkye with the Bootloader, I flashed erSky9X (x9d_rom.bin) to my Taranis Radio.
With the new Telemetry Cable installed and using the external DJT Module and is bind to a D8R-II Receiver and made the setting changes of FrSky COM port to "2"
in the TELEMETRY 2 Menu page, this will give you full Telemetry Readings to your Taranis Radio when using the external DJT Transmitter Module.
See Photos: :D
1_Taranis with ERSKY9X firmware.jpg
1) Taranis with ERSKY9X firmware.
2_Taranis with DJT Module plus Telemetry Cable.jpg
2) Taranis with DJT Module with new Telemetry Cable installed.
3_Taranis with full DJT Telemetry_erSky9X.jpg
3) Taranis with full DJT Telemetry using erSky9X firmware.
4_Taranis with full DJT Telemetry using erSky9X.jpg
4) Taranis with full DJT Telemetry using erSky9X firmware.jpg
Note: With the external DJT module the RSSI Signal is Higher and more Stable, then when using the internal XJT Transmitter with the OpenTX firmware.
Is there a reason to why there is a difference between the DJT and XJT RSSI signal readings and also when using between erSky9X and OpenTX firmware ? :?:

Bob
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Re: Low RSSI

Post by MikeB » Mon Jul 21, 2014 11:47 am

As far as I'm aware both ersky9x and openTx just report the RSSI value as provided by the module. It's possible that ersky9x may use different averaging that provides a more stable reading. This might, I suppose, give a higher reading, but more likely the DJT, with its aerial in a different place, may just give a better signal!

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Re: Low RSSI

Post by bluzjamer » Fri Sep 05, 2014 2:01 am

Have been using my Taranis since July this year. I have one of the early ones. I have updated to the latest firmware. I have 6 models set up on it. Four with 4 channels and 2 with 6 channels..I have had no problems with the 4 channel RX's. I put a 6 in the Radian Pro and have had no problems with it. I also have it in a Samuarai powered glider. Today was the first flight. The hand toss was good and I then took it up to 400 feet. The plane was flying smooth and was responsive until I started getting a low RSSI announcement . A few seconds later the plane lost connectivity and lawn darted from 200 feet..Plane is wrecked.
I tossed up the Radian Pro and at 500 feet it too also started to broadcast Low RSSI warning. I brought it down as fast as I could and landed. Never had this problem before, all batteries on TX and plane were fully charged. I did a range check with the RP and it showed low RSSI of 42 at 90 feet. I have the 2000 mah battery in the TX. Where do I go from here? Using the D6FR RX's, any inherent problems with this RX? Although I got my Taranis in early 2013, I didn't put it into use until this July due to health issues.
Bob

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Re: Low RSSI

Post by jhsa » Fri Sep 05, 2014 10:26 am

What about the other 4 channel receivers? Did you also flew them at the same distance without problems?
I do own a couple of D6FR receivers but they actually show better RSSI than my other rx. I don't have a taranis though, I use a DJT module.

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Re: Low RSSI

Post by bob195558 » Fri Sep 05, 2014 5:23 pm

Hi bluzjamer,

Do you have access to an External XJT (and/or D series DJT) Transmitter Module ?
If you do, you could try a Range-Check between them to compare the two different RSSI transmitter signals.

One member of our small RC group had a similar problem several months ago.
Though it is not the same as to what you are experiencing, maybe the problem
could be with the Internal XJT Transmitter: (viewtopic.php?f=95&t=6118)

Bob
Last edited by bob195558 on Sat Sep 06, 2014 10:50 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Low RSSI

Post by Rob Thomson » Sat Sep 06, 2014 8:17 am

Any chance you have two modules?

If both are, running there is a chance you could get a swamping issue?
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Re: Low RSSI

Post by lebenj » Wed Sep 10, 2014 9:09 am

hello,

i have 3 F3K gliders, all full carbon except the nose where there is the receiver.
they are all with D4R-II receiver antenas outside the nose ( and 90º ). so normaly it's a good orientation.

for the moment, i'm using a T9X with DJT emisor.
at about 100m altitude and 150-200m far, it's very often to get low rssi alarm when the nose of the glider is not toward me. so when i'm circling, i have about 1/4 of each circle with alarm on....
I set my alarm at 42... And i've NEVER lost control of a glider with a FR-SKY receiver. and many time i can fly much more high and far away (200m high, 300m far)

during the range test, where must be the plane? right on the field or a little bit higher (on a chair), because sometimes, in a normal range position, if the plane is on the grass, at about 40m, i can have RSSI critical alarm!

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Re: Low RSSI

Post by bob195558 » Sat May 16, 2015 3:49 pm

These are quotes from eePSkye (viewtopic.php?f=91&t=2835&p=95217&hilit ... nal#p95201)
The XJT transmitter RSSI Signal maybe able to be improved when Mike has time to do some experiments with it.
bob195558 wrote:Hi Mike,
Could the filtering on the RSSI value from the XJT Transmitter be changed to match the the DJT that is sending
its values more frequently ?
Bob B.
MikeB wrote:I probably need to do some experiments. Currently, due to the different update rates, the DJT has 16 values averaged and the XJT just has 2. I must have had a reason for this at the time, I'll need to check the exact update rates.
It is very easy to change if required.
Mike.
bob195558 wrote:Hi Mike,
If the XJT RSSI alarm values can be improved, it will be a big help to have a more consistent RSSI alarm.
When time permits, thank you Mike for looking into this.
Renaming the SWR (return telemetry signal) to TSSI/SWR is OK with me too.
Bob B.
Kilrah wrote:The D system sends an RSSI value every telemetry frame, which is every 4th 9ms frame or about 27 times per second.
The X system sends about 2 per second, so heavy filtering would likely increase the response time too much. I think we use 5 samples on OpenTX.
Bob B.
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Re: Low RSSI

Post by MikeB » Sat May 16, 2015 4:19 pm

I'll increase the averaging samples to 4, from 2.

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Re: Low RSSI

Post by bob195558 » Sat May 16, 2015 7:24 pm

Hi Mike,
Thank you, let me know when and which test Radio firmware,
and I will check out the RSSI signal with the change of averaging samples rate to 4. :)
I have the Taranis-x9d, Sky9x and 9x radios.

Added request: With erSky9x-x9d for the Taranis-x9d, I could compare RSSI signals between internal XJT, external XJT module and external DJT module.

Bob B.
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Re: Low RSSI

Post by bob195558 » Thu Jun 11, 2015 1:18 am

Results from comparing RSSI RX signal between test version erSky9x-x9d (VERS: V.737-Mike, DATE: 13.05.2015,
SVN: erx9d-r218, MOD: X9D)
and the newer test version erSky9x-x9d (VERS: V.968-Mike, DATE: 08.06.2015,SVN: erx9d-r218).

Hardware used:
Taranis-x9d Radio, D8R-II Plus receiver,
Internal XJT transmitter (PXX/D8/Com1),
External XJT Module (PXX/D8/Com1) and (PPM/D8/DipSwitch 1 ON/ Com2 with external Telemetry Cable [DJT mode]),
External DJT Module (PPM/D8/Com2 with external Telemetry Cable).

RSSI RX signal readings recorded 100 feet away.
First readings, radio is stationary.
Second readings, radio held out at arm length and rotated from left side to center to right side. (I added this part because when a pilot is standing in one place and moves the radio around the RX signal changes.)
The signal strength readings are low to high and I also took note of the speed that the readings took place (fast or slow).

Older test firmware V.737
Internal XJT (PXX): RX = 59 to 67 (8) and Moving = 57 to 72 (15) (Speed: fast)

External XJT (PXX): RX = 63 to 68 (5) and Moving = 57 to 68 (11) (Speed: fast)
External XJT (PPM [DJT mode]): RX = 61 to 64 (3) and Moving = 59 to 68 (9) (Speed: slow)

External DJT (PPM): RX = 61 to 63 (2) and Moving = 61 to 70 (9) (Speed: slow)
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Newer test firmware V.968:
Internal XJT (PXX): RX = 64 to 65 (1) and Moving = 62 to 69 (7) (Speed: slower)

External XJT (PXX): RX = 57 to 58 (1) and Moving = 66 to 71 (5) (Speed: slower)
External XJT (PPM [DJT mode]): RX = 61 to 62 (1) and Moving = 61 to 67 (6) (Speed: slow)

External DJT (PPM): RX = 59 to 61 (2) and Moving = 61 to 66 (5) (Speed: slow)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The results indicate an improvement with the increased numbers of averaging samples on the RSSI signal.
Thank you Mike ! :D

Bob B.
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