Can this Full fledge FPV system be done with stock RF module

Are you in-to First Person Viewing? Got an interesting hack/mod? Let us know!
User avatar
Kilrah
Posts: 11108
Joined: Sat Feb 18, 2012 6:56 pm
Country: Switzerland

Re: Can this Full fledge FPV system be done with stock RF mo

Post by Kilrah »

kaos wrote:then, the 200 mW FPV TX/Rx you are talking about should be good for 2Km then?
In theory yes, if using the same 11dBi patch I do with the 20mW. Never tested the 200mW myself yet though.
kaos wrote:Kilrah, take a good look at the pic, it says Saitek on the base of the stick (Saitek at top, Cyborg at bottom, Cyborg is one Saitek flystick model). I think it sounds more and more the system 1.5 box is a converter for USB signal to PPM signal, that is why it has to be used with the Aeo x-1500 'digital' gyro not other head tracking gyro.
I'm still sure the joysticks are modified. I found a post by AEO themselves here:
http://www.wattflyer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=49552
The simulating driving device is upgraded by us based on the Saitek equipment.
The simulating control device supplied by AEO is special for simulating driving, just using it with System 1.5.
Which I would understand and "translate" to something along the lines of "The Joystick supplied by AEO is a modified Saitek device, and can only work with system 1.5"...

User avatar
kaos
Posts: 3247
Joined: Wed Dec 28, 2011 1:15 am
Country: United States

Re: Can this Full fledge FPV system be done with stock RF mo

Post by kaos »

I reviewed your post. ha, did not notice you have a goggle. where do you get your patch antenna? will the cloverleaf anntena do the same thing?

and yes, that post by the AEO sales is interesting. he did say the box works with 'paddles', but AEO site does not have a paddle listed. hmm still hope ;) I hope they just don't want any body to go out and buy the Saitek stick and buy theirs. ;) and just saying it is 'modified'. cross the fingers.
I will write an email to AEO this evening. Now over there is 2:00 Am. Just ask them directly. May be pretending I am a dealer trying to sell their product in the US. requesting some detailed info. ;)
User avatar
Kilrah
Posts: 11108
Joined: Sat Feb 18, 2012 6:56 pm
Country: Switzerland

Re: Can this Full fledge FPV system be done with stock RF mo

Post by Kilrah »

kaos wrote:I reviewed your post. ha, did not notice you have a goggle. where do you get your patch antenna? will the cloverleaf anntena do the same thing?
It's this one I have: http://www.goodluckbuy.com/5-8ghz-11dbi ... ystem.html

Yeah I actually have several sets of goggles. The one I use most now with the 9x is the one you mentioned in your post earlier today.

Image

Cloverleaf is different, it's an omnidirectional antenna, which receives well all around you but with little gain. The patch has a lot of gain, but in just one direction. So when you'll want to fly a longer distance, you'll point it towards your target.
User avatar
kaos
Posts: 3247
Joined: Wed Dec 28, 2011 1:15 am
Country: United States

Re: Can this Full fledge FPV system be done with stock RF mo

Post by kaos »

Thank you. that clarified a lot about the antenna Transmission /Receiving concept for me.
Hmm, looks like an antenna signal tracker is in the cooking. :)
User avatar
Redbrickman
Posts: 219
Joined: Tue Dec 27, 2011 9:43 pm
Country: -

Re: Can this Full fledge FPV system be done with stock RF mo

Post by Redbrickman »

I don't have any experience of the 9x and those antennas but the first 5db gain antenna wouldn't give much of an increase in my opinion.

The patch antenna might be a different story and I'm guessing someone on here has experience of using it or similar.
Maintain thine airspeed.
Lest the ground arise and smite thee!

User avatar
kaos
Posts: 3247
Joined: Wed Dec 28, 2011 1:15 am
Country: United States

Re: Can this Full fledge FPV system be done with stock RF mo

Post by kaos »

I think that is right: not much increase. read many review/report, seems both ends are equal. Yes, it does. No, it doesn't. But I think I am going to get one to use it on my stock RF module. When I get my FRysky module , i want to preserve the stock module and make it plug and play too.
User avatar
kaos
Posts: 3247
Joined: Wed Dec 28, 2011 1:15 am
Country: United States

Re: Can this Full fledge FPV system be done with stock RF mo

Post by kaos »

Just found a 600VTL camera for FPV. I think I am going to switch to this one. from the actual review video, takes a lot better video than the 16.00 one. especially for sharp contrast area.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/350544043519?ss ... 2879wt_980

Sent an email to AEO. let's see what they say about the joystick and sytem 1.5.

And found this: http://www.dragonlabs.net/site/DragonOSDplus

for 250, true auto pilot and return home capability. Hmm, this project is getting expensive. :D
User avatar
kaos
Posts: 3247
Joined: Wed Dec 28, 2011 1:15 am
Country: United States

Re: Can this Full fledge FPV system be done with stock RF mo

Post by kaos »

OK, bad news, This is the answer from AEO:
The system 1.5 main board can be only used with the joystick we provide

because we installed special hardware and software to be compatible with system 1.5.

The original Saitek joystick can not work with it, wrong connecting may cause the damage ,please pay attention.
I sent another email to ask them if they would sell the chip installed in their joystick.
User avatar
Kilrah
Posts: 11108
Joined: Sat Feb 18, 2012 6:56 pm
Country: Switzerland

Re: Can this Full fledge FPV system be done with stock RF mo

Post by Kilrah »

Yeah, seems to confirm they actually have a chip that generates PPM in the joystick, and that the system 1.5 is just a PPM mixer. And thus that using USB plugs is totally wrong.

That doesn't surprise me knowing AEO's prior practices :mrgreen:
User avatar
kaos
Posts: 3247
Joined: Wed Dec 28, 2011 1:15 am
Country: United States

Re: Can this Full fledge FPV system be done with stock RF mo

Post by kaos »

:mrgreen: Well, this may be a stupid question. with lack of electronic knowledge, can you hook AEO joystick directly to Tx trainer port and skip the system 1.5?

Hmm, that seems to be a good project for the nerds here:
make a 'mystery' box, you can plug any USB device (ie, Saitek joystick, throttle...) and translate to the er9x trainer port and let er9x do all the mixing. That person who comes out with this will be named King of the Nerds. :mrgreen:

and Ha
found a good OSD system with OSD, 10Hz GPS, plug and play OSD (no autopilot, fly home) for 92.00 for smaller plane
any opinion on this one:
http://www.foxtechfpv.com/foxtech-ce-osd-v15(new-interface-metric-and-imperial-)-p-170.html
User avatar
kaos
Posts: 3247
Joined: Wed Dec 28, 2011 1:15 am
Country: United States

Re: Can this Full fledge FPV system be done with stock RF mo

Post by kaos »

OK. the whole project is in motion. Just ordered some items that has pretty much everyone's approval for FPV:
1. Frysky DJT mdule with 8ch rx
2. Frysky 7db antenna
3. HK 200 mW FPV Tx/Rx combo (5xx5 Mhz)
4. 11 db 5.8 GHz Antenna as Kilrah suggested

get a 600 TVL cam, OSD system, goggle, DVR then it is complete. Still working on which OSD to get {one for full function(auto pilot, auto flying home) , one basic}
Here is another reasonable priced OSD with 10 Hz Gps and 'auto return home' function:
http://www.goodluckbuy.com/cyclops-nova ... r-fpv.html
User avatar
kaos
Posts: 3247
Joined: Wed Dec 28, 2011 1:15 am
Country: United States

Re: Can this Full fledge FPV system be done with stock RF mo

Post by kaos »

Ha, found a 600TVL cam with 3.6 and 6 mm lens for 37.04. grab it if you can use it:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/160757143551?ss ... 1439.l2649

and this this SMA adaptor for my DSMX module:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/400273287906?ss ... 1439.l2649
User avatar
kaos
Posts: 3247
Joined: Wed Dec 28, 2011 1:15 am
Country: United States

Re: Can this Full fledge FPV system be done with stock RF mo

Post by kaos »

What do you think about this long range system? 40KM! interference? really work?

http://www.terranova.net/~winger/RCVide ... onLink.htm
User avatar
kaos
Posts: 3247
Joined: Wed Dec 28, 2011 1:15 am
Country: United States

Re: Can this Full fledge FPV system be done with stock RF mo

Post by kaos »

Finally, decided the OSD system. The Cyclop Nova with RTH: http://www.ebay.com/itm/170809612579?ss ... 1438.l2649

I figure for 7.00 more it has just about everything the HK system has and with RTH capability.

The only thing missing now is the HK 640x480 goggle , just out of stock today (checke last night still in stock). :-S

If it takes too long to be back in stock, I may get the 7" LCD display Erazz got 1st and mount it on the Tx handle. :)
User avatar
kaos
Posts: 3247
Joined: Wed Dec 28, 2011 1:15 am
Country: United States

Re: Can this Full fledge FPV system be done with stock RF mo

Post by kaos »

Is it possible for this little antenna to have a 16 DBi gain? or it is bluff?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/251003639325?ss ... 1438.l2649
User avatar
Kilrah
Posts: 11108
Joined: Sat Feb 18, 2012 6:56 pm
Country: Switzerland

Re: Can this Full fledge FPV system be done with stock RF mo

Post by Kilrah »

I frankly doubt it has. Plus, a 16dBi omni is useless for FPV. In order to achieve 360° horizontal coverage with gain, it cuts (a lot) into vertical coverage. So assume you put that antenna vertically on the receiver, to be within the coverage zone where gain is significantly useful, you'd have to fly within an angle of at most about 5° measured between ground and airplane from the antenna's point of view. Not to mention that half of the coverage is lost in the ground.
User avatar
kaos
Posts: 3247
Joined: Wed Dec 28, 2011 1:15 am
Country: United States

Re: Can this Full fledge FPV system be done with stock RF mo

Post by kaos »

What about using it as the Tx antenna (for Fyrsky module)?
User avatar
Kilrah
Posts: 11108
Joined: Sat Feb 18, 2012 6:56 pm
Country: Switzerland

Re: Can this Full fledge FPV system be done with stock RF mo

Post by Kilrah »

Same problem. Radiation pattern is so tiny you'll never be flying inside.
User avatar
jhsa
Posts: 19480
Joined: Tue Dec 27, 2011 5:13 pm
Country: Germany

Re: Can this Full fledge FPV system be done with stock RF mo

Post by jhsa »

I don't know if it was here that you were talking about this but here you go.. Look what I found.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cHlyLClyfek
My er9x/Ersky9x/eepskye Video Tutorials
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL5uJhoD7sAKidZmkhMpYpp_qcuIqJXhb9

Donate to Er9x/Ersky9x:
https://www.paypal.com/cgi-bin/webscr?cmd=_s-xclick&hosted_button_id=YHX43JR3J7XGW
User avatar
kaos
Posts: 3247
Joined: Wed Dec 28, 2011 1:15 am
Country: United States

Re: Can this Full fledge FPV system be done with stock RF mo

Post by kaos »

Absolutely. That is the 'idea'. but not so clunky like that. I hope that pacth antenna behind his butt by gathering so much radiowaves won't fry his butt. :mrgreen:
The idea is right. but much refined. At least needs to sit down instead of carrying a commando pack. :)

The whole idea is using the joy stick and throttle in place of the Tx. with goggle (he use a LCD screen in front that is funny). You control with joystick and throttle and rudder with the life like flight control with OSD. Patch the longer range antenna for both RC Tx and FPV Tx and sit it on the side. you fly with joystick,throttle, paddle that are attached to the Tx.
Now imagine this. you have a VTOL plane or a heli. you got your long range Tx , FPV set up right. You sit comfortably at your patio/yard drinking your favorite champagne. You take off and fly 2-3 kM and landed right back in your own yard/patio. Have another sip of champagne and fly again. :mrgreen: :geek:

I am now looking at the mesh / patch antenna with higher gain to see if that will increase the distance for both RX Tx and FPV Tx. After all, it won't hurt to put a pole in your back yard /patio. :)

Suggestion on that would be appreciated too.
User avatar
jhsa
Posts: 19480
Joined: Tue Dec 27, 2011 5:13 pm
Country: Germany

Re: Can this Full fledge FPV system be done with stock RF mo

Post by jhsa »

Yeah I've read that some people use an LCD instead of the goggles. What's wrong with it anyway? It might be a cheaper solution.. the goggles are very expensive..
My er9x/Ersky9x/eepskye Video Tutorials
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL5uJhoD7sAKidZmkhMpYpp_qcuIqJXhb9

Donate to Er9x/Ersky9x:
https://www.paypal.com/cgi-bin/webscr?cmd=_s-xclick&hosted_button_id=YHX43JR3J7XGW
User avatar
jhsa
Posts: 19480
Joined: Tue Dec 27, 2011 5:13 pm
Country: Germany

Re: Can this Full fledge FPV system be done with stock RF mo

Post by jhsa »

oh, and I think somewhere on that video's comments it says that he wants to use it for rescue purposes. something like that. that's why he is standing and has all that gear on him..
My er9x/Ersky9x/eepskye Video Tutorials
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL5uJhoD7sAKidZmkhMpYpp_qcuIqJXhb9

Donate to Er9x/Ersky9x:
https://www.paypal.com/cgi-bin/webscr?cmd=_s-xclick&hosted_button_id=YHX43JR3J7XGW
User avatar
Kilrah
Posts: 11108
Joined: Sat Feb 18, 2012 6:56 pm
Country: Switzerland

Re: Can this Full fledge FPV system be done with stock RF mo

Post by Kilrah »

I stand on my experience-backed opinion that joystick adds nothing but complications and bulk, and less precision.

When you fly FPV, especially with goggles, you concentrate so much on the image and the flying that you don't even notice the difference between standing and sitting. Same goes for the actual control input. It just becomes second nature, you just think about turning left and unconciously do the movement it takes to do it, you don't think "I need to push that nice joystick I have in front of me to the left"... so whatever is actually there doesn't matter (unless you just want to show off :mrgreen: )
User avatar
kaos
Posts: 3247
Joined: Wed Dec 28, 2011 1:15 am
Country: United States

Re: Can this Full fledge FPV system be done with stock RF mo

Post by kaos »

here is one antenna I am looking at. wonder if that will help the RC Tx range? (2.4 GHz)
http://www.ebay.com/itm/320860354845?ss ... 1438.l2649

and this is for the FPV (5.8Ghz)
http://www.ebay.com/itm/160732864097?ss ... 1438.l2649

question is the yagi will have to be fro the RC tx on the ground while the rx on the plane will still be the same old little antenna. Does this really increase the reange for the RC Tx.

and for the mesh 5.8 GHz would be the receiving antenna for FPV transmission. while the transmission on the plane for FPV is still the little single pole for cloverleaf antenna. Can this help the receiving the FPV signal?
User avatar
kaos
Posts: 3247
Joined: Wed Dec 28, 2011 1:15 am
Country: United States

Re: Can this Full fledge FPV system be done with stock RF mo

Post by kaos »

Kilrah wrote:I stand on my experience-backed opinion that joystick adds nothing but complications and bulk, and less precision.

When you fly FPV, especially with goggles, you concentrate so much on the image and the flying that you don't even notice the difference between standing and sitting. Same goes for the actual control input. It just becomes second nature, you just think about turning left and unconciously do the movement it takes to do it, you don't think "I need to push that nice joystick I have in front of me to the left"... so whatever is actually there doesn't matter (unless you just want to show off :mrgreen: )
I agree it does not make any difference to control the plane. But it is for the 'real' fly experience. :geek: and as you said, not me, show off. :)
User avatar
kaos
Posts: 3247
Joined: Wed Dec 28, 2011 1:15 am
Country: United States

Re: Can this Full fledge FPV system be done with stock RF mo

Post by kaos »

jhsa wrote:Yeah I've read that some people use an LCD instead of the goggles. What's wrong with it anyway? It might be a cheaper solution.. the goggles are very expensive..
nothing wrong, but you won't get the effect of indulging in the fly, just like you watch a 24 inch TV and a 80" TV. :)

that is another reason why I was looking at that high resolution goggle, previously posted, designed for gaming or movie without the receiver and has to be attached with RCA to the FPV rx.
User avatar
kaos
Posts: 3247
Joined: Wed Dec 28, 2011 1:15 am
Country: United States

Re: Can this Full fledge FPV system be done with stock RF mo

Post by kaos »

here is another question: how do you record your FPV fly? using ground DVR? what do you use?
User avatar
jhsa
Posts: 19480
Joined: Tue Dec 27, 2011 5:13 pm
Country: Germany

Re: Can this Full fledge FPV system be done with stock RF mo

Post by jhsa »

I tried some goggles and after a while my eyes were hurting
I think the goggles would make more sense if we had 2 cameras on board to have real 3D.. just me thinking
My er9x/Ersky9x/eepskye Video Tutorials
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL5uJhoD7sAKidZmkhMpYpp_qcuIqJXhb9

Donate to Er9x/Ersky9x:
https://www.paypal.com/cgi-bin/webscr?cmd=_s-xclick&hosted_button_id=YHX43JR3J7XGW
User avatar
Kilrah
Posts: 11108
Joined: Sat Feb 18, 2012 6:56 pm
Country: Switzerland

Re: Can this Full fledge FPV system be done with stock RF mo

Post by Kilrah »

Actually the "screen size" isn't necessarily larger with goggles than with an LCD. All depends on the FOV of the goggles and the distance at which you watch the screen. Resolution is less important. What's good with goggles is "isolation" from outside light, but you can get that with an LCD as well if you do a proper mount.
Just forget about those antennas unless you want to fly 10km and more.
For those you need to have very precise GPS-based tracking, to make advantage of a 26dBi mesh antenna you need to be pointing at the plane continuously with a precision of about +/- 2 degrees.
User avatar
jhsa
Posts: 19480
Joined: Tue Dec 27, 2011 5:13 pm
Country: Germany

Re: Can this Full fledge FPV system be done with stock RF mo

Post by jhsa »

If I would get into FPV, would be with small planes or even an easystar, just around the place I am at.. don't want to go big distances cos don't want to put anyone in danger. will go to an empty field and fly there. that's good enough for me..
also would have to be cheap cos I don't have so much money at the moment.. so I think the LCD and some rubber would have to do the job.. also don't need so much power.. 500 meters for safety would be more than enough. for RC link, I think my frsky module with normal antenna would be more than ok. now I would have to have sound as well.. :D
for 500 meters what power video tx should I get in 5.8GHz??

Thanks
My er9x/Ersky9x/eepskye Video Tutorials
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL5uJhoD7sAKidZmkhMpYpp_qcuIqJXhb9

Donate to Er9x/Ersky9x:
https://www.paypal.com/cgi-bin/webscr?cmd=_s-xclick&hosted_button_id=YHX43JR3J7XGW

Post Reply

Return to “FPV Projects”