Audio (voice) - Stock 9X PCB

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Re: Audio (voice) - Stock 9X PCB

Post by magnetus »

nothing connected to pin 3. ohm out the pins and no shorts
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Re: Audio (voice) - Stock 9X PCB

Post by andrewju »

I'm in the middle of designing an audio board that will replace the stock switch board on the 9x. Does anyone know if there is an element already available in Eagle that represents the stock power switch? I'm still not very comfortable with Eagle and searching for new elements seem to be an issue...
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Re: Audio (voice) - Stock 9X PCB

Post by MikeB »

I gave up searching in Eagle and just created my own for anything like that. Besides, I also didn't trust some of the existing devices. I used a 64 pin TQFP once, and the pads turned out to be spaced too far apart!

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Re: Audio (voice) - Stock 9X PCB

Post by andrewju »

Wow! Ok. Then I have a good chance to learn something new and find out how to create new elements in Eagle.

I'll share my design when it reaches a meaningful draft stage.
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Re: Audio (voice) - Stock 9X PCB

Post by jhsa »

Yes please. What kind of size you have in mind? 1206?

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Re: Audio (voice) - Stock 9X PCB

Post by andrewju »

The board will be based on the "AudioMega by Oliver" design described in the Wiki. Yes, it uses SMD components, most of which are 1206 and bigger (if you ask me, these are even easier and more fun to solder than the through-hole components).

Oliver's board was created as an add-on to the stock switch board. I learned that it doesn't fit good with some speakers. So I want to replace the stock switchboard completely, which should give a little more space to the speaker itself and be nicer overall.

The new board will also include MAX232 signal inverter for FrSky telemetry. I use XJT, so the inverter will be tested to work with S.Port (in fact, I have it working already on my radio). The DJT (HUB protocol) should be supported as well - although I didn't get a module to test this one, yet.
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Re: Audio (voice) - Stock 9X PCB

Post by andrewju »

Mike,
For the new "Serial Voice" option, which Atmega328 pins do we need to make available (meaning easy to solder to) for future upgrades (3-pos switches, push-buttons, UFO communication, ...)?
I think I saw you posted such a list somewhere, but now I'm a bit lost in all these discussions.
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Re: Audio (voice) - Stock 9X PCB

Post by jhsa »

2 of the LCD lines. We now use D0 and D1 for the left vertical trim and D2 and D3 can be used for the switches..
Of course Mike could confirm this just in case I'm wrong. ;)

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Re: Audio (voice) - Stock 9X PCB

Post by andrewju »

I think there are more pins that can be used (at least that was my understanding).
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Re: Audio (voice) - Stock 9X PCB

Post by MikeB »

This is the post where I listed possibilities: viewtopic.php?f=5&t=2&start=2280#p94469.

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Re: Audio (voice) - Stock 9X PCB

Post by andrewju »

A-ha, so these are X1, X2 and X3 (pins 24-26 of the Atmega). Thanks!!!
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Re: Audio (voice) - Stock 9X PCB

Post by flybabo »

If your board is dedicated to the serial interface, you don't need 'CLK' and 'BUSY' signal generator built around two transistors.
If so, PC0 and PD2 can also be used for future use in addition to PD3, PD4, PD7, PB0 and PC1/2/3(=X1/2/3).
It would be a good idea to put an LC filter(10uH+100nF) option to AVCC(Analog VCC) pin as we may use X1/2/3 for analog inputs.
Both 9X and 9XR board have such filter to reduce the processor switching noise.
Please refer to Figure 24-9 in ATmega328 manual or 9X board schematic.
Also, don't forget to add several soldering pads for VCC/AVCC/GND/AGND.
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Re: Audio (voice) - Stock 9X PCB

Post by jhsa »

In my case I will be using an arduino, so I guess it will have to use the normal ground. Maybe it is ok, we will see..
If I had to change the arduino itself there wouldn't be a point in building something that everybody might be able to accomplish :)
Also I doubt most of the people that already own a megasound board will mod it to that extent..
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Re: Audio (voice) - Stock 9X PCB

Post by andrewju »

flybabo wrote:If your board is dedicated to the serial interface, you don't need 'CLK' and 'BUSY' signal generator built around two transistors.
Are you sure? This will simplify the board quite a bit! (we could remove the 2 transistors, 4 resistors and a cap).
If so, PC0 and PD2 can also be used for future use in addition to PD3, PD4, PD7, PB0 and PC1/2/3(=X1/2/3).
If these will really become free - I should make them available.
It would be a good idea to put an LC filter(10uH+100nF) option to AVCC(Analog VCC) pin as we may use X1/2/3 for analog inputs.
Both 9X and 9XR board have such filter to reduce the processor switching noise.
Please refer to Figure 24-9 in ATmega328 manual or 9X board schematic.
Also, don't forget to add several soldering pads for VCC/AVCC/GND/AGND.
I see VCC and AVCC are connected together (in both Mike's design and on the Oliver's board). Do you mean these should be separated?

EDIT: I think I got what you meant with this one (reading the datasheet before asking questions always helps a lot!). Now the only question is whether it really makes sense to add this filter. I'm gonna need to check the placement of these elements (will look into it tomorrow, as it's 2am here)...



Also, I see that the stock switch board has a ground plane on one side. I'm not sure, but I think it could probably help to protect sound amplifier against interference from RF module. So does it make sense to do it in a similar manner on the new board? I.e. most of the components will be located on the bottom side of the board (where the power switch is), and the top side will act as a ground plane.
On the other hand, I won't be able to move all of the components on one side of the board. So maybe it's not worth the efforts...
Last edited by andrewju on Thu Mar 26, 2015 10:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Audio (voice) - Stock 9X PCB

Post by MikeB »

If using serial to the Megasound then CLK and BUSY are no longer needed. so PC0 and PD2 become free.
The Megasound didn't use and analog inputs so AVCC was not filtered.

A ground plane i susually a good idea.

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Re: Audio (voice) - Stock 9X PCB

Post by andrewju »

Thanks a lot! Will try to sort it out tomorrow!
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Re: Audio (voice) - Stock 9X PCB --=UPDATE=--

Post by magnetus »

got an arduvoice module to work (arduino pro mini + sd card reader + lm386). i dont know why my megasound board does not work. i think i will give up on it and keep working with my arduvoice. still need to add filters, backlight and beeper.
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Re: Audio (voice) - Stock 9X PCB

Post by andrewju »

Am I correct thinking AVCC and AREF should be connected together, as these are both analogue voltages?

Also, I have another idea:
There is a wire on the stock switch board that connects the battery to the "External power" port (charging plug). Since I never use this one for charging (and I believe there are many people like me) I thought I could reuse that wire for telemetry. If S.PORT signal will go over this wire, there will be no need to add an extra connection between two halves of the radio. I find it very convenient. There will be some changes necessary to board on the back of the radio - but that's easily doable during the regular telemetry mod.
I see just one downside here: the DJT module will still need another wire from the back of the radio to the switch board (where signal level converter is)... But in fact, there is a good DJT mod that does not need level converter at all - so maybe it's not worth to try and make DJT support on this board at all.
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Re: Audio (voice) - Stock 9X PCB

Post by MikeB »

Both the XJT SPort signal and the DJT telemetry signal are serial INVERTED data, the SPort is 0-5V, the DJT is -6V to +6V.

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Re: Audio (voice) - Stock 9X PCB

Post by andrewju »

But for DJT there is a nice mod that allows to get TTL-level signals in the "right" polarity directly from the module itself.

Anyway, we need two wires for DJT (since we also want to SEND some data to the module), and for XJT we only need 1 wire. So that may allow to connect XJT without actually routing new wires to the back of the radio.
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Re: Audio (voice) - Stock 9X PCB

Post by jhsa »

For the XJT you will need a level converter anyway, right??

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Re: Audio (voice) - Stock 9X PCB

Post by andrewju »

Yes. The level converter for the XJT will be built into the new power switch board. Initially I thought I should support both XJT and DJT. But since DJT will likely be wired differently anyway, I think I could limit the level converter function to support XJT only. And by reusing the stock "ExtPower" wire I will eliminate the need for an additional wire connecting two halves of the radio.

Let me finish something and I'll put an Eagle file here... I'm not too good at explaining my thoughts, so maybe a picture will help. :)
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Re: Audio (voice) - Stock 9X PCB

Post by MikeB »

Are you assuming everybody uses a LiPo for power?
I run low self discharge NiMh and my charger copes with the diode so I charge using the standard charge socket.

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Re: Audio (voice) - Stock 9X PCB

Post by andrewju »

MikeB wrote:Are you assuming everybody uses a LiPo for power?
You're right, this was the major assumption. Maybe not everybody, but I thought many of us do.
I run low self discharge NiMh and my charger copes with the diode so I charge using the standard charge socket.
Ooops! I think you're the first one reporting to use the stock charging socket.

Well, then I have a jumper to select whether that wire gets routed to the power switch (stock option) or to the telemetry input.

I have uploaded my files here. These are created in Eagle 6.6, so if you cannot open them - maybe I can export to some other format (if that is possible at all).
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Re: Audio (voice) - Stock 9X PCB

Post by flybabo »

andrewju wrote:Am I correct thinking AVCC and AREF should be connected together, as these are both analogue voltages?
Since er9x firmware uses an internal analog voltage reference, AREF should be uncoupled from AVCC and tied down to GND
via a 100nF capacitor to increase the noise immunity.
Refer to 24.5.2 ADC Voltage Reference section at datasheet.
Also, the GND noise may be reduced by putting a 10uH choke between AGND and GND pins.
AGND pin is a GND pin next to the AREF pin.
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Re: Audio (voice) - Stock 9X PCB

Post by andrewju »

Are you talking about MegaSound or the stock 9x mainboard?

On the MegaSound AVCC, AREF and VCC were all connected together. I now uncoupled AVCC and VCC, adding the choke and a cap (to GND). I also moved AREF to AVCC, but now I'm confused - should I keep it as is, or should I tie it to GND?
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Re: Audio (voice) - Stock 9X PCB

Post by MikeB »

To be clear, on the radio main processor, running er9x, the analog reference is AVCC with an external capacitor on the AREF pin.

The Megasound curently has no analog input firmware.

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Re: Audio (voice) - Stock 9X PCB

Post by andrewju »

Does it make sense to add a cap to AREF pin on the sound board, too? I am correcting some mistakes separating VCC and AVCC, so I can add an extra cap, if needed.
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Re: Audio (voice) - Stock 9X PCB

Post by MikeB »

Yes.

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Re: Audio (voice) - Stock 9X PCB

Post by jhsa »

It will be very difficult for people that bought the voice board to mod it.. Maybe better to test it as it is and see if there are any problems..

will have to check how the arduino is built.. But it will stay as it is. Not because I can't do it, but because that voice board is supposed to be easy to build ;)

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