Audio (voice) - Stock 9X PCB

flybabo · Post by **flybabo** » Tue Feb 10, 2015 9:59 am

I'm running at 12MHz with 5V at this time. I don't have a FTDI board, I just have a USBASP.
Actually, I don't need the bootloader since I won't program the sound module using the serial I/O.
How do I do it with USBASP?

Post by **jhsa** » Tue Feb 10, 2015 11:30 am

You have to connect to the same lines the SD Card uses. MISO, MOSI, SCK. Also ypu must connect to the RST. You must remove the sd card everytime you flash. Question, are you using one of those sd card modules we buy on ebay? You can't use a sd card directly with 5v or you will destroy it.

I'm trying with one if those modules. But can't make the arduino talk to the card.

ReSt · Post by **ReSt** » Tue Feb 10, 2015 12:35 pm

jhsa wrote:
I'm trying with one if those modules. But can't make the arduino talk to the card.

I'm interested if you can find a solution for reading the SD card.
I'm playing around with a 1.8", 128*160 pixel TFT color module with an attached SD card module.
It happened only one or two times that the Arduino (Nano V3.0) was able to read an image file and display the picture on the display.

Reinhard

flybabo · Post by **flybabo** » Tue Feb 10, 2015 8:39 pm

jhsa wrote:You have to connect to the same lines the SD Card uses. MISO, MOSI, SCK. Also ypu must connect to the RST. You must remove the sd card everytime you flash. Question, are you using one of those sd card modules we buy on ebay? You can't use a sd card directly with 5v or you will destroy it.

I'm trying with one if those modules. But can't make the arduino talk to the card.

Yes, I'm using a 5V MicroSD card purchased from a local store which is same as the one sold at eBay with a cheaper price.
It's connected to mhotar's pcb (viewtopic.php?f=5&t=948&start=3300#p48603) with 3.3V LDO removed and shunted for 5V operation.
The SD card just has a 3.3V regulator and a 74V125 logic level translator - schematic attached.
This design has a bug in CS/MISO logic - MISO(DO) should be Hi-Z if CS is not active.
Pin 13 of V125 should be tied to pin 8 not to the ground to support multiple SPI peripherals.
It may not work if you have multiple SPI clients in your arduino.

Post by **jhsa** » Tue Feb 10, 2015 8:57 pm

flybabo wrote:I'm running at 12MHz with 5V at this time. I don't have a FTDI board, I just have a USBASP.
Actually, I don't need the bootloader since I won't program the sound module using the serial I/O.
How do I do it with USBASP?

But is it working?

João

EDIT: That is the Sd Card module I'm using.

flybabo · Post by **flybabo** » Tue Feb 10, 2015 9:04 pm

I don't see the backlight.

I might screw up in merging the bootloader and amod_last.hex.
I'll retry sometime in this week.

Post by **jhsa** » Tue Feb 10, 2015 11:26 pm

Some progress, Thanks Mike.
This is working at 5V 16Mhz. If that idea of connecting the voice module to the radio over serial become reality, then the number of extra components could be greatly decreased I think..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZtHfwWVn_PE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yA7Sut_QQl4

João

flybabo · Post by **flybabo** » Thu Feb 12, 2015 10:02 am

Since I didn't get the backlight, I checked all the connectivities and it was all OK.
I observed that 100Hz negative pulse signal was applied to CLK (pin 4) but no signal at any output pins.
I took out the processor, soldered a 28pin DIP socket, put a new processor and programmed a combined hex with USBASP.
Bingo, it now talks!
I'll start my part of experiment from this long weekend starting with rerouting trim switches.
Thanks for everyone making this cute thing happens!

bob195558 · Post by **bob195558** » Thu Feb 12, 2015 3:06 pm

jhsa wrote:As the Megasound board has been discontinued and many of us can't do fine soldering, I started to play with an arduino and a SD Card module for arduino that we can buy cheap on ebay.. I think it could be possible to build a voice module using an arduino, the SD Card module, and an amplifier module with an LM386, also sold very cheap on ebay. Being kinda modular maybe it could even fit inside the 9XR radio, who knows.. Mike sent me a file that should work at 16Mhz but I'm having mixed results with it.. Sometimes I can read and write to the card using eepe, and sometimes I can't.. I've now put this on standby until Mike has some time for this. Also if the voice module could talk to the mainboard via serial, it could reduce the number of additional components, and avoid the fine soldering to the LCD Lines. I believe that moving the trim switches to the voice board (arduino) would not be so difficult. I believe that the only difficult soldering would probably be to the resistors on pins 27 and 28 of the atmega64..
João

jhsa wrote:Some progress, Thanks Mike.
This is working at 5V 16Mhz. If that idea of connecting the voice module to the radio over serial become reality, then the number of extra components could be greatly decreased I think..
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZtHfwWVn_PE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yA7Sut_QQl4
João

Hi João,
I am interested in your using Arduino hardware for Sound Board for 9x Radio's.
I look forward to trying this new mod when build instructions become available.

Bob B.

Post by **jhsa** » Thu Feb 12, 2015 5:44 pm

At the moment I have this. I still didn't test it. didn't even check if it has errors, so, don't build it yet. will try to build it later. As ytou can see on the pic, this board also has the audio amp (LM386) on it. it mesures about 70mm x 55mm. It will probably fit the 9x on top of the mainboard, but probably not the 9XR.. I will probably have to split it in several little boards that could be put wherever they fit on the 9XR

Someone else would have to test it though..

Looking at the pictures, do you guys think that a person with minimum soldering skills could build this? I used only through hole components.

Also I will probably wait until the serial connection instead of the LCD lines is fully developed.

João

Post by **MikeB** » Thu Feb 12, 2015 7:06 pm

I'm thinking about how to handle using the Megasound over the serial. To do this, we need to move two of the trim switches to the Megasound. Initially, for my development/testing, I shall move them to PC3 and PC2 on the Megasound, these are X1 and X1 on my circuit, but I believe on the HC1969 board they are only accessible on the processor pins. Also, I shall work on my '128 board and the firmware changes will only be available on that and the '2561, not the M64 to start with.

The plan is to have the Megasound board sending a status 'packet' every 10mS that indicates whether it is busy and the currect status of the trim switches. When not busy, the main processor may request a voice file to be played by sending a 'packet' to the Megasound.

If a back or restore operation is required, these packets will stop being transferred until the backup/restore operation completes.

This method of handling the trim switches should work fine as the same method works on the TelemetrEZ board for the THR and AIL switches (and a roatry encoder). Bear in mind that when playing a voice file, the Megasound may not be able to do much other processing if you are thinking of asking for extra functionality.

I want to get this basic functionality working first, before thinking/planning anything else.
Once this is working, we may move the trim switch signals to two of the connections that currently go to the LCD data lines, but I don't want to disconnect these while testing unitil all is working.

There is no timescale for completing this, I have another development taking up quite a bit of my time at present.

Mike.

Post by **jhsa** » Thu Feb 12, 2015 7:24 pm

Thanks Mike, that is great.
Mike, to test at the beginning, we don't have to modify the radio yet I believe? My idea is to just add some switches to the megasound board, it doesn't have to be the actual trim switches as they are normally open, right?? Just some push buttons would do the job, as long as we don't touch the radio ones when serial is working?

João

flybabo · Post by **flybabo** » Thu Feb 12, 2015 7:28 pm

Mike, is there any problem using LCD_WR and LCD_RESET pins?
I'm working on that direction as I prefer to minimize the wiring between main board and the voice card.
When do you plan to commit the next version of er9x/amod328?
I better to start with the latest and the greatest code.

Post by **jhsa** » Thu Feb 12, 2015 7:50 pm

I think, the idea is not to solder to the LCD lines?

And as the board is not in production anymore, not everybody can build it unless it is really easy. That is why I'm trying to build something easy that someone with no so good soldering skills could also build..
But I don't know, maybe it could be better if the trims stayed on the main board and leave the voice module pins for other stuff.. For example, we could pass the haptic to the voice module. I still didn't install haptic because I would have to solder a wire between 2 wires already soldered to the processor

What about moving the telemetry to the voice module too? These are all good ideas but let's see what Mike says..

João

HC1969 · Post by **HC1969** » Tue Feb 17, 2015 7:04 am

Good news! I started the manufacture MegeSound 9X again! Because of the many interested so decided. The parts ordered soon, indicates that where it is available.
For anyone interested, please contact me by e-mail! So the candidates who serve foremost.

Please watch the news!

flybabo · Post by **flybabo** » Tue Feb 17, 2015 7:57 am

I rerouted LV trim switches of 9XR board to Pin39(PC4:LCD_WR) and Pin35(PC0:NC).
I modified about 10 lines of er9x code and everything works as usual.
It required removal of one 5.1K SMD resistor and two trace cuts as shown in the following picture.

: Removed 5.1K SMD resistor on top of pin 39 and two trace cuts near R33 and R37

Rerouting LV trim DWN signal (originally connected to Pin28) is easier since removed resistor pad can be used for soldering to Pin39 (RED).
LV trim UP signal has to be soldered to the processor Pin35 (BLUE).
I used Kynar wire wrap wires (30AWG) for rerouting and the difficulty level is similar to the FrSky telemetry mod.

: Rerouted LVTrim DWN to PC4 (RED) and UP to PC0 (BLUE)

This mod works for both 9X and 9XR stock LCD but it's not applicable to a special LCD using two CS signals as Mike mentioned before.
Eventually, this mod will eliminate 6 connections (Backlight,PB7,D0-D3) between 9X/9XR board and voice module.
At the end of the day, we may need to modify the MegaSound 9x board as well.

Post by **jhsa** » Tue Feb 17, 2015 8:38 am

Well done. But I think that moving the trims to the megasound board might be a better approach if doable. It will involve only removing some wires from the connectors where the trims are conected and connect them to the megasound board. As you say, the degree of difficulty is about the same as for the telemetry mod. That means too difficult or even impossible for some of us. My idea, in case the board stops selling again, is to provide people with an easy way of building their own voice board with only through hole components and if possible modular. Using for example an arduino and a cheap SD Card module from ebay. Of course, none of that makes sense if for connecting it to the radio they have to do micro soldering.. I know HC1969 said he would produce the board again. But he might stop making them as soon as there is less demand. And then?
We definitely need an easy DIY alternative..
Just my 2 cents...

João

flybabo · Post by **flybabo** » Tue Feb 17, 2015 8:48 am

It's always better if we have alternatives for some of us with different skill levels

Post by **jhsa** » Tue Feb 17, 2015 9:02 am

Yes of course. But routing the trims that way it is going to be difficult for most. And if there is an easier way to do it, I believe we should go for it. What is the cost? 3 less connections to the voice module instead of 5 less connections? I would say we are still winning

João

Post by **jhsa** » Sun Feb 22, 2015 2:31 am

New voice pack for er9x. I hope it works ok. Untested.. Enjoy!!

viewtopic.php?f=64&t=2195&p=30081#p30081

João

Daedalus66 · Post by **Daedalus66** » Sun Feb 22, 2015 2:33 pm

It works for me. Thanks!

Post by **MikeB** » Tue Mar 10, 2015 4:35 pm

I now have the Megasound board working using just the serial connections, there is no longer any need for the LCD signal connections or the connection to PB7. It is necessary, however, to re-route the two trim switch signals from the direct connection to the processor and on to the Megasound board.
I've done this by removing the wires from the connectors and taking them directly to the Megasound board. That way, there are no board mods needed, just the two serial wires connected to the processor (or the resistors beside the processor).

I'm going to prepare some instructions on how to connect the Megasound using the serial.

One extra I've added is to monitor all FOUR of what were the LCD signals as switch inputs. Two are the trim switches, but the other two will be new switch inputs. All four of these are passed to the main processor. Hopefully, I'll be able to handle these extra switch inputs in the firmware, although the M64-frsky version may not be able to cope due to lack of spare flash.

I've been testing on a '128 board, and I have an option under hardware where you choose between the LCD type connection and the serial connection.

If you have the serial connection, you also get the backup and restore functions to/from the SD card on the Megasound board for your models.

For the M64-frsky version I'll shall need to build two hex files, one for the LCD connection mode and one for the serial connection mode.

Mike.

Post by **jhsa** » Tue Mar 10, 2015 5:00 pm

Mike, there's another pin you could use.. PD2, the former CLK pin. It is also free and could be used for something else..

João

Post by **MikeB** » Tue Mar 10, 2015 5:16 pm

Not as easily on the Megasound board with the transistor switching on this connection. There is no pullup resistor available.
I looked at that connection and decided it wasn't very suitable without modifying the board.
I also thought 2 extra inputs were quite good anyway.

Mike.

Post by **jhsa** » Tue Mar 10, 2015 5:31 pm

Couldn't people just cut a trace? or remove the transistor(s)? 2 extra inputs are good. 3 are better..

Maybe an output too?

we could control and extra module connected to the trainer port as an example.

I just mentioned it cos my most recent module doesn't have transistors anymore

João

flybabo · Post by **flybabo** » Tue Mar 10, 2015 7:20 pm

Great Mike!
I'll add an option for the trim switches rerouted to Atmega PC0/PC4 as soon as you release the source code.

It turns out that rerouting of the trim switches is not bad for 9XR board as one can use a 4051 AMUX pin as a soldering point for PC0.
If he/she can solder LCD/serial connections to the MegaSound board, he/she can do this rerouting as well.

Also, there's no need to control backlight from MegaSound for the 9XR board as it already has a transistor controlling the backlight.
The transistor is driven from PB7 thru a resistor and it needs an extra work to reroute the backlight signal thru the MegaSound for
those 9XR owners. (Note that there's no soldering pad for PB7 in 9XR board)
That will also relieve PB1 for some other use for the 9XR.

In addition to PD2, PC0 can also be used for an additional in/out if one cuts a trace or removes one component.

Even though MegaSound board has no LC filter for AVCC, I think we still can use X1/X2/X3 for the analog inputs like sliders
and 6-way switch with a proper software filtering.

Time to need a MegaSound board "HACK" guide

Post by **MikeB** » Tue Mar 10, 2015 10:43 pm

One thing I've always wanted to do on the 9X is to use PB7 instead of PB0 to drive out the PPM/PXX signal. This could then be controlled by either OC1C or OC2 to use hardware to give an accurate signal. Currently the code has to be done very carefully to prevent too much jitter on the signal. I've never understood why the original design used PB0, when PB7 was not used.

While actually playing a voice file, the Megasound processor is working quite hard. We would need to make sure it could read any analog inputs while playing.

I've still got quite a bit of work to do to handle any extra digital inputs inside er9x, and extra analog inputs will take even more.
It is unlikely much of these extra inputs can be handled on the M64 9X, unless there are some other features we can remove. I shall definitely be removing POT-SCROLLING from the M64-frsky version to make some space available.

Mike.

flybabo · Post by **flybabo** » Wed Mar 11, 2015 12:28 am

Mike,
It's an excellent idea to use PB7 for PPM/PXX for accurate waveform generation.
It may be a perfect time to add an option to use PB7 for the right purpose - all you need is a simple rerouting
and adding one more checkbox in eepe

ADC may be run in free-running mode. If we need more processing power, we can upgrade
MegaSound board to 5V/20MHz as it will bump up the performance 1.67x.
It can be done by removing 3.3V LDO and shorting in-out pins, replacing Xtal/resonator, and connecting
a cheap 5V MicroSD card. My voice card runs at 5V, 20MHz without having any problems.
We suddenly see a lot of possibilities.
Thanks,
HT

Post by **jhsa** » Wed Mar 11, 2015 3:36 am

well, if that is the case there goes my work down the drain then. I have been trying to find an easier way for people to built their own voice module. With a great help from Mike we got an arduino pro mini 16Mhz fully running with serial, here is the video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AQnrJr0JabQ

If we will have to replace crystals or resonators, then all this doesn't make sense. Probably most of the people that bought the megasound board can't do that fine soldering.
That is why I'm trying to build with through hole components, and also ready platforms like the arduino and the sd card module.. I just don't use the amplifier from ebay because it would need to be modified. So, better to build our own. The board on the video measures about 70mm x 42mm. I'm building at this precise moment another voice module that uses 2 boards. Maybe that could fit inside the 9xr too. someone would have to build one and check because I don't have a 9xr.
I will open a thread for this project when I have some documentation..
João

flybabo · Post by **flybabo** » Wed Mar 11, 2015 4:02 am

You've already got 33% performance boost by using an Arduino with 16MHz crystal and
this may be good enough for the future enhancement IF it really happens.
Replacing the crystal in your Arduino board doesn't seem to need so called fine soldering
when it becomes necessary

If I need to build an audio amplifier on a strip board, I rather put entire circuit on the same strip board
by using a DIP version of 328P rather than using a ProMini.

According to my simplified serial voice card schematic, component count associated with the audio amp
is lot more than that of processor circuitry (21 vs 8 ?) - you just need to add 8 more components
(328P + 5V regulator + crystal + 5 caps) to your audio board rather than connecting to separated ProMini.

openrcforums

Audio (voice) - Stock 9X PCB

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