HELI TEMPLATES and Set Up Guide

[Westy]

Trex-450-500-600 config.eepe

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Hey All .,..... just thought I would share what I have learnt with Setting up my heli with ER9x

I had heaps of challenges but now have my heli-set up perfect for me with good soft expo settings around Aileron and Elevator stick (Right - Mode 2) good for hovering so the stick is less sensitive around centre stick and gets more aggresive as you move the stick further out hence EXPO!

ANyhoooo.....


Here is my complete mixes set up



Note, This config is after all my gains are set up ..... I had set up my gains to work off Pot 2 (p2) this allowed me to use the pot to dial in my gyro gain and set up Rate and HH mode of the GEAR switch..... If you want to set that up you can add this in.....

So in the Mixes add this to channel 5
CH5
+ 50%P2 Switch(GEA) Offset 100
+ -50%P2 Switch(!GEA) Offset 100


And your Switches need to be set up like this too!!!!




Some of the problems I had setting up:

Found the swash plate had way too much aggression in movement!!! .... so....

How to Fix swash plate that is too aggressive

* Go into your heli model menus and go to menu 3/10


- 100 Is super agressive
- 0 is no movement at all.
I found that
77 to be about right for beginners and 85 - 90 for good pilots ... until you get up to 100 of course


One of the other problems I stumbled on
Could not get enough negative pitch or pitch range on Cyclic pitch (even with -125 and +125 on limits for ch 1, 2 & 6

So ... I could get only +2 degrees and off the clock +12 with my limits set at -125 and +125

To bring the swash ring further down to get your range..... try this:

How to raise and lower the swash on the main shaft

Go into you heli menu and since I have all my collective on CH11 (you will se that in menu 3/10 with your 120 degree swash type and swash ring settings)...
Go to the MEnu Mixer 5/10... Scroll down to CH 11 and you should see something like this if you have programmed it correctly.

Note Settings will vary based on your link and servos so you will have to set it up to work for yours
CH11
+ - 77 THR ID0c4 (The further negative you go.... with throttle in 0 position, the lower the swash will sit on the shaft and give you more NEG pitch)

The Above Setting gave me -2 deg pitch
+ - 100 THR ID1c5 (Throttle in 0 position, c5 is my Idle up 1 pitch curve)
The Above setting gave me -10 deg pitch at 0 throttle position (perfect for upside down rapid lift)


What else did I have issues with ....... ah yes .....

I could not get -10 degrees pitch to +12degrees pitch even with my Curve 4 (your ID0 Pitch curve) at -100 to +100 .... and my limits to 100% + and - so .... I learnt that if you go into the menu 2/10 on your model scroll down and change E.Limits to ON (this allows extended limited on all your limits menu..... changes from max of 100 to 125 and -125 too ).

You can also do it in EEpe here



That is about all I can think off for now ..... here is my complete config eepe file if you want it

File 1 (FEB 28 Complete) is pre set up config for heli with Gain controls on the P2 Pot (great for on the fly gain set up in the air!!!!) once you have the right gain you can then put those values into the limits on channel 5 and then remove the 2 mixes on channel 5 in the mixes menu ( hope that makes sense)

These eepe files will include the following models
450 Heli (all helis are the same - just rename the model to suit your model)
Heli Sim - For computer Simulator game config
Plane Sim - For computer Simulator game config
Range test - For testing your range on your RX and Tx

File 2 (28Feb-exposet_pot gain removed.eepe) is how the config will look once it my gain value was known and I removed the Gain Sets on Channel 5

SPECIAL NOTE:
So Please Peoples ..... set up your own Pitch curves once you have completed your head set up..... this should be done exactly as Finless Bob's videos (Yes the one and only!)

This can be time consuming and frustrating to understand at first ... but is most important as the smaller the heli .... the more unforgiving it is in this area and unstable.

Remember to put (on the 450 anyway) your Aileron Servo (Right Front) in the bottom mounting hole on the right side of the heli. Make sure you trim the servo arm off very close to the ball as it may hit the main gear and chatter when in full negative pitch and pulling full right on the aileron. - If you put it on the left ... it will destroy servo, arm and main gear.


* Zero Trims and sub trims

* 100% all end points

* Set your pitch curve to linear 0 , 25, 50, 75, 100

* Set your throttle curve for 0, 0, 0, 0, 0 - Remove pinion as a safety precaution if you have motor installed

* Mid stick (collective pitch)

* 90 degrees on all (powered up and centered) servo to arms to swash plate

* Level Swash linkages at the pre manual described lengths (if not described or not described correctly as in many Trex copy's follow below) These lengths will change as we move on.....

* Pull Full COllective Pitch

* Adjust the servo to swash linkage length so that the wash out base has a very small amount of clearance between the top of it and the bottom of the head block

CAUTION: you will have to adjust bottom linkages longer or shorter to get it right .... if it is too high and hits the head block ... your servos will get damaged (start buzzing) from the excess loading up.... and if you do not get it right ... you will get it binding on the lock spacer on the bottom of the shaft.


* once you have the above sorted ... .there is not need to further adjust the mechanical linkages on the swash to the servo arms.... for now!!!!

NOW YOU HAVE LEVEL SWASH AND CORRECT HEAD BLOCK HEIGHT ADJUSTMENT....NEXT

We now need to set up the wash out arms on the washout block. So ....

WASH OUT BLOCK SET UP....

* Set your Collective at MID STICK ......

* You might now notice that the wash out arms are not lined up correctly. they should be level across all the screws.... if they are not you need to adjust the next 2 links up the chain to get the wash out arms level. level.... now this will cause the base to hit the bottom of the head block when you push up to full collective... so you will now have to balance back and forth until you get the correct clearance to the base ...and .... get your wash out arms level across the wash out base have to shorten the bottom 2 links equally to get the wash out base off the bottom of the head block.
The Whole time you need to make sure you are altering all the links for both sections equally to keep the swash level. So bottom 3 links ... stay equally lengthened and shortened .... and the same for the washout base to the seesaw arm.

Now you can set up your pitch..... MID STICK & Zero Pitch

Adjust the top 2 links from the seesaw to the washout arms.....



Hope this helps ..... cheers

Westy

[B12]

Thanks, I will look this very closely since I have my HK450GT heli yet to be set up with er9x. No matter what people say about the original firmware, it is very good and straight forward for heli use.

[merinkumar]

thank you westy, i copied all the settings to my tx, but i cant use eepe file as am not able to use the eepe withe chines usbasp i got (its locked, only with their software it works), i have one question in the heli setup, collective channel is setup as ch11 in the post, but in the eepe file you have provided, the trex 450 shows collective as ch09, should it be ch11 ?

[Westy]

Not sure where you get that....

The File I attached has the Collective on CH 11 (in the Heli SEt up menu)...

and in the Mixes menu....... you can see what it is in the tutorial above ... CH 11 and has the mixes to get the curves all mixed in..... IDo ID1 and ID2 (C4 5 and 6 (pitch curves to the throttle curves C1,2 and 3

[Westy]

Of course your Pitch curves will be different....... to suit your heli swash and servos.

[gohsthb]

Westy,
It appears you didn't set zero pitch at center stick. This is probably why your pitch curves are kinda crazy. You need to level your collective servos. So the arms are at 90 degrees when your throttle stick is in the middle. Then you need to mechanically set your links so the blade pitch is zero at this position. Only after you have done that can you figure out how much pitch you get either positive or negative.
Also there are some errors in your eepe file. CH14 has extra mixes in it, this was breaking the sticky throttle cut function. The dual rates for elevator and aileron were only set for one side of the stick travel. Another note about helicopter setup - you have a mix on CH11 to center the pitch if you enable the throttle hold. This will not be good. If you are crashing or need to do an auto rotation you will need the pitch to still work. I find it is best to leave the pitch unaffected by the throttle hold.

One final note about the original 9x software. That was why I switched to Er9x. I like having both dual rate and expo on a helicopter. For whatever reason I could have expo with no low rate or low rate with no expo on the stock firmware. So very good I would say is incorrect, more like workable would be right.
-Gohst

Edit: I fixed the eepe file. However I left you pitch curves and limits as you had set them.

[Westy]

Hi Ghost...... Thanks for correcting that.

I had figured that out ... but have not been back in here to fix it..... I have updated the original file. Cheers again.


Initially when I started this heli addiction ... I was confused about that exact thing as my heli assembly manual showed throttle position at mid stick at 75% and pitch at mid stick ..... +5 - +6 deg.....

did not take me long to figure out that was not right as it bogged down and was a sluggish pig!

SPECIAL NOTE:
So Please Peoples ..... set up your own Pitch curves once you have completed your head set up..... this should be done exactly as Finless Bob's videos (Yes the one and only!)

This can be time consuming and frustrating to understand at first ... but is most important as the smaller the heli .... the more unforgiving it is in this area and unstable.

Remember to put (on the 450 anyway) your Aileron Servo (Right Front) in the bottom mounting hole on the right side of the heli. Make sure you trim the servo arm off very close to the ball as it may hit the main gear and chatter when in full negative pitch and pulling full right on the aileron. - If you put it on the left ... it will destroy servo, arm and main gear.


* Zero Trims and sub trims

* 100% all end points

* Set your pitch curve to linear 0 , 25, 50, 75, 100

* Set your throttle curve for -100, -100, -100, -100, -100 - Remove pinion as a safety precaution if you have motor installed

* Mid stick (collective pitch)

* 90 degrees on all (powered up and centered) servo to arms to swash plate

* Level Swash linkages at the pre manual described lengths (if not described or not described correctly as in many Trex copy's follow below) These lengths will change as we move on.....

* Pull Full COllective Pitch

* Adjust the servo to swash linkage length so that the wash out base has a very small amount of clearance between the top of it and the bottom of the head block

CAUTION: you will have to adjust bottom linkages longer or shorter to get it right .... if it is too high and hits the head block ... your servos will get damaged (start buzzing) from the excess loading up.... and if you do not get it right ... you will get it binding on the lock spacer on the bottom of the shaft. - You can reduce this with your mixes channel Channel 11 line on is the normal mode curve ..... reducing the % in the first line reduces the amount the swash travels up and down the main shaft.


* once you have the above sorted ... .there is not need to further adjust the mechanical linkages on the swash to the servo arms.... for now!!!!

NOW YOU HAVE LEVEL SWASH AND CORRECT HEAD BLOCK HEIGHT ADJUSTMENT....NEXT

We now need to set up the wash out arms on the washout block. So ....

WASH OUT BLOCK SET UP....

* Set your Collective at MID STICK ......

* You might now notice that the wash out arms are not lined up correctly. they should be level across all the screws.... if they are not you need to adjust the next 2 links up the chain to get the wash out arms level. level.... now this will cause the base to hit the bottom of the head block when you push up to full collective... so you will now have to balance back and forth until you get the correct clearance to the base ...and .... get your wash out arms level across the wash out base have to shorten the bottom 2 links equally to get the wash out base off the bottom of the head block.
The Whole time you need to make sure you are altering all the links for both sections equally to keep the swash level. So bottom 3 links ... stay equally lengthened and shortened .... and the same for the washout base to the seesaw arm.

Now you can set up your pitch..... MID STICK & Zero Pitch

Adjust the top 2 links from the seesaw to the washout arms.....



Below I will post some of my latest EEPE files...... work for 450 and 500 .... one small change for Ele servo direction for the Trex 600


UPDATE .... I have now found that I set ID2 with the channel set up to provide mid stick and -100 throttle for any collective stick position.
Westy

[Measuredpath]

thanks for the informative post

[Westy]

PRINT OUT OF THE CONFIG

[Westy]

500 Print out of set up.

[Westy]

Here is my....... complete TX set up Current as of Today July 2012

[Westy]

here is a simple set up of how to set up your heli....... 8 minutes tops...... as long as you have your channels on your RX set up correctly .,.. it will work sweet as.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vh07PXw8Efc

[Measuredpath]

I do have one question and this is where on earth does the pitch curve get adjusted?

[Westy]

Normal Pitch curve is on Curves menu .... curve 4 is pitch for normal mode ....

Curve 5 Is for ID1 up

Curve 6 Is for ID2

[Measuredpath]

I must say that this is truely awesome. I am currently awaiting my 450 Clone to show up so I can put all the pieces together. In the meantime I have been studying the transmitter and how the mixes work, DR, EPO, etc. I am also glad to see a vibrant and supportive community here. Thanks

[Westy]

Excellent ..... if ya need any help .... I am sure the guys and gals her will certainly help out as much as they can!

[Measuredpath]

Is there ever a need to use the 9 point curves versus the 5 points?

[Westy]

I have never used or needed to use them. I know they will give you a more smoother curve ..... but your ESC usually takes care of that

[Ozzy]

Hi Measuredpath,

Use companion9x, there is a complete 9x simulator, so if you have not got your 9x yet, you can still test out all the mixing, expo, DR, and just about everything, truly cool.

Ozzy

[Westy]

You can also do the same with EPEE! Just hit Simulate .... and move your mouse and grab each lever and move it .... and then click hte IDO, ID1, ID2 to test your curves .... even move your pots etc.... and you can also check your Throttle hold t make sure the channel 3 is held at -100 when engaged.

[kaos]

I don't think you can use swash ring at 100/aggressive because your servo will probably be binding way before that.
someone correct me if I am wrong here.

the limit for each cyc ch is needed to level the swash at top and bottom stick, subtrim to level at mid stick. This is how you achieve complete swash leveling at any stick position.

ch11 in heli setup and its mixes % is where you set your max collective pitch and take out servo binding at extreme collective stick movement.

the swashing ring is where you set your cyclic pitch and take out the binding at extreme cyclic stick movement. Once it is set, that is your max cyclic pitch and without servo binding.

if you don't have equal travel at top and bottom stick, you should adjust your linkage rod length to get them equal. EXT limit can work some times, but the best way is to adjust the linkage rod to get equal pitch. Then you can achieve the max pitch that specific set up is capable of. then you can use the pitch curve to limit the max collective pitch to the way you want or use DR without worrying your servo will bind when you increase the % in ch11.

I set my heli collective always at + - 12 degree and cyclic at 8-9 degree. (the sum of collective and cyclic should not exceed 20-21 degree to avoid engine bog down) I am lazy, if I can get more than +-12 degree, I just use pitch curve to limit either way to 12 degree. If I want less than 12 degree I can use DR to do that. But I hardly use DR, may be some EXP to reduce the sensitivity around mid stick at times depends on the heli.

I agree with GHosthb that using DR / expo is the way to adjust the sensitivity. If I use the swash ring to reduce my max cyclic pitch, I have to remember what is my max swash ring setting when I want to go to higher cyclic pitch without binding after the set up. Using DR/EXPO, I don't need to worry about my servo will bind like changing the swashring setting. DR effectively limit your collective to the % of max pitch.

I know this er9x has tons of different ways of doing the same thing. I like to keep it simple.

[Westy]

Thanks Kaos.......

In my experience with Swash ring settings (I start with 55 - 65 max) .... it is simply the amount of actual cyclic movement moving your ele and ail stick (Right Stick for mode 2) ..... if you dial it right down .... you get drastically reduced swash ring movement about the swash centrepoint thus reduces the amount of actual responsiveness of your heli.

I tend to follow Finless bobs practice of 0 trims and 0 sub trims ..... get your linkages and servo arms right by mixing and matching them to get perfect 90 degrees....(90 deg mechanical and level swash at mid stick and 0 blade pitch degrees)....and then make sure your washouts are level through all 3 hinge points compared to the flybar. then use the sub trims to mix out the CCPM at high and low stick to maintain level swash (thus stability throughout range or pitch curve). USE your Channel 11 percentages in each mode to reduce your pitch max high and low points..... you can use your ID1 Pitch curve to reduce your negative pitch if you do not want -12 deg.

Kaos is right .... there are many many ways to configure the setups .... I like my template method as you start with the basics and keep it simple right through the range ..... my You Tube channel covers a lot of it ..... you tube rent2ownnz if anyone wants a lool at some interesting points/ lessons and tips .... and also a live demonstration on pitch curves and CCPm set ups! - Forgive the noise..... but live is live! no fun without my Trex 600 motor winding up to the max....

Cheers
Westy!

[Westy]

Remember I set up ID2 as your 0 pitch and mid stick position for set up only ..... once you have it all configure and tracking all done .... I copy curve ID1 pitch and Throttle in case you mistakenly hit the switch too hard and miss ID1.....

You can also set up ID0 ..... for a reduced throttle curve with normal pitch curve of -2 to +12 .... for learning ..... and then ID1 for full normal throttle curve of -100, +20, +60, +80, +100...........

and then use ID2 for full 3d mode with a V throttle curve and linear pitch curve of -100, -501 0, +50, +100


Just a couple of options..... let me know if you have any issues ... happy to help

[Measuredpath]

I've finally been able to put almost everything in practise. The template from you proved to be very useful thus far. Tomorrow I can finally setup my gyro and have my maiden flight within the next few days.

[Measuredpath]

I can not for the life of me setup the Assan GA-250 gyro. Anyone have a clue as to why?

[gohsthb]

I have a bunch of ga-250s. What are you having trouble with?
-Gohst

[Measuredpath]

I figured it out. It was such a simple step missed. Thanks for your reply.

[Measuredpath]

How's the Tarot ZYX setup going? I just picked up one and will be doing the setup on it soon.

[huntermichael]

Is there a template for just Scale flying on a 450? I dont want to do 3d as I am putting a Augusta Coast Guard fuselage over mine. I am new to heli's and just want to do the basics on the plain frame before I put the fuselage on it.

[Andyuk]

hi guys ive used your settings on my 9xr which all work fine but the pitch servo which is locked down hill any help would be nice thanks