"Flip" button on Syma X1/WLToys v949

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Re: "Flip" button on Syma X1/WLToys v949

Post by jhitesma » Thu Mar 14, 2013 6:24 pm

Sounds great and I think I'm on the right page finally :D

Honestly swapping modules isn't a big deal, it was my misunderstanding about the firmware for the module vs. firmware for the TX that got me tripped up. Since reflashing my TX to swap modules wouldn't be very practical in the field!

I've been considering the setup Daryoon has on his blog (http://www.hacksmods.com/er9x-dsm2-mod/) with the module from a DSM TX mounted internal to the 9x for about a year...but since I don't have anything that's DSM yet I haven't been in a hurry to do it. I don't think it's really necessary to have a magic "all in one" module though it is a nice dream...but with a internally mounted DSM module that could do DSM and Devo and your new module that can do FlySky with flip....well heck that's almost as good as an all in one module :)

If the Walkera module could be convinced to do DSM and Devo then I may have to open my 9x back up and warm up the soldering iron soon...I haven't been following that discussion for awhile since it sounded like work had stalled on the software side when I last checked in. And to be honest my RC habit took a bit of a break over the summer (Living in the desert it's not a heck of a lot of fun to fly when it's 113F out and most of my hobby budget gets redirected towards feeding the AC!)

BTW - totally unrelated side note. I just now looking at Dar's website finally realized what the heck his logo is :) It's been bugging me for over a year what the shape in the red circle is. Somehow I've missed the context of it on his site until just now. This is just a morning of silly revelations for me :D


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Re: "Flip" button on Syma X1/WLToys v949

Post by th9xer » Thu Mar 14, 2013 6:48 pm

Since reflashing my TX to swap modules wouldn't be very practical in the field!
Yes, right got ya.

I think another version of my module to support DSM2/X and Devo is totally possible. I will be able to tell more when the Devo module arrives. I know a lot of people have gone dual internal modules, I guess I just like em changeable.

Apparently PhracturedBlue has already convinced the Devo module to do DSM and with telemetry to ! The code is all there, so once again I would only need to borrow his work and cram it into an AVR. No promises as to when, I hadn't really intended this little project to grow.

I ain't a city dweller by nature so when I hear you guys and your tales of wide open spaces I fall in love regardless of the temperatures. As you say though the AC bills might get on my wick !

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Re: "Flip" button on Syma X1/WLToys v949

Post by Kilrah » Thu Mar 14, 2013 9:50 pm

th9xer wrote:Yes thanks. Pinout pitch, pcb, and shielding can dimensions would be good so I can generate the 3D model.

While I have you Kilrah, I spotted your Hubsan X4 FPV video over on RCGroups, stunning !!!
I am guessing the Tx was something like this ? http://www.rangevideo.com/index.php?mai ... cts_id=304
And the camera like this ? http://www.aliexpress.com/item/New-Arri ... 70883.html

Cam.
OK, the module is 17.8x26mm. Shield 16x20.7mm, well centered. Pins have 2mm pitch, with 2mm thick plastic carrier. The carrier is aligned with the PCB edge, so pins are 1mm from the edge. For the pinout, see photo.

Thanks, my TX is a similar one but in 20mW, it already heats up and drains battery more than enough. The camera looks about the same size, but a bit different, and with a custom fisheye lens :)
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Re: "Flip" button on Syma X1/WLToys v949

Post by th9xer » Thu Mar 14, 2013 10:29 pm

Excellent thanks, can I ask where the 20mw Tx came from ? Sorry everyone, off topic, I know.

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Re: "Flip" button on Syma X1/WLToys v949

Post by TheObstacle » Fri Mar 15, 2013 10:54 pm

I don't know about the 20mw ones, but I've bought the 200mw and 10mw 5Ghz boards from http://www.fpvhobby.com/ and they both work pretty well. Surprisingly (to me), they were shipped from Turkey instead of China, so they might get to the UK a bit quicker. Seemed about the same to the U.S. :)

I also got a couple of almost identical looking 200mw boards from aliexpress. I've been told some of them aren't 5v tolerant (there's a spot for a 3.3v regulator on the board under the shielding that some of them apparently omit). Either way, the 200mw ones get HOT on 5v, I run mine off of a 3.3v switching regulator and that seems to make them happier.

I've also got one of these: http://www.foxtechfpv.com/58g-20mw-mini ... p-210.html , it's nice and compact, but the lens is pretty narrow angle. It starts to work off of 1S on the Syma X-1 quad, but it was dropping out when I fired up the motors until I put it on a voltage step-up to 5v. If you get one of these and want to cut off the barrel jack, beware -- the DC plug actually has a tiny board inside with what appear to be dual 3.3v regulators that are somehow isolated from each other. When I took that off and tried to run the whole thing on a single 3.3v source I got terrible noise in the video feed.

Edit: ordered one of these last night: http://www.aliexpress.com/item/5-8g-wir ... 04093.html , mostly because I've been looking for an easy way to show off FPV to spectators, but the TX it comes with looks promising as well.

Edit 2: urgh... apparently the one I ordered is the wrong band (band "A", not band "B"), and so can't talk to the video transmitters I already have. It looks like the right one to order would probably have been http://www.aliexpress.com/item/5-8g-wir ... 25843.html , or maybe http://www.goodluckbuy.com/5-8ghz-5-inc ... 8h-b-.html for just the receiver.
Last edited by TheObstacle on Thu Apr 04, 2013 5:26 am, edited 1 time in total.


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Re: "Flip" button on Syma X1/WLToys v949

Post by robopony » Fri Mar 22, 2013 7:47 pm

Are there PCBs available to put this module together, or is there someplace I can have one made? I've got the avr and a7105 transceiver module, but still need to get the last bits together.

This has been an amazing thread to follow, but the more I learn the more I realize I know nothing! I picked up the Saleae Logic analyzer to try to follow along back in February, but without reading your posts to know what to look for, I don't think I could have found anything. You guys are just incredible!

Thanks!

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Re: "Flip" button on Syma X1/WLToys v949

Post by akkuschrauber » Thu Mar 28, 2013 10:45 am

THAT's what I waiting for so long now :D incredible !
Nice work !

If it's possible, I would like to have a PCB please, so I can fly my Hubsan X4 with my 9x :D
I got a working a7105 transceiver module from my v949 and the other parts should not to be a problem to get together for me.
What could be the price for only a PCB and delivery to germany ?

Thank you and greetings,

Claus

Please don't tell me to do self etching, I don't got all the stuff for that ...
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Re: "Flip" button on Syma X1/WLToys v949

Post by JohnEdwa » Sun Mar 31, 2013 11:19 am

Now this seems like a bunch of people who know what they are doing.
I posted about using these transmitter boards with the 9x months back, but this seems like a good place to revisit it.

Mainly, the HJ V997 Mini-pet has a board like this and the WLtoys v202 has one like this (the front one).

Could this design be modified to work with these boards as well ?

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Re: "Flip" button on Syma X1/WLToys v949

Post by kaos » Wed Apr 03, 2013 8:30 pm

this thread is now very interesting to me. I just got a WL Toys v959. I am able to use the stock module with er9x to fly and set up different fly character, throttle cut all that. I believe with extended limit it will flip without the 'flip' button. this has been shown with stock FW /module on youtube for v929 which also has a 'flip' button.:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SFOeBt_a ... r_embedded#
although I have not tested the flip yet, only flew 4 packs so far. two with stock tx and two with T9X. ;)

my question is V959 has switches for turning on/off leds and cam switches: one for video on/off, one for photo shoots. Can this device mentioned in this thread be able to do the switching?
As of now I can't make my er9x/stock module to turn on the led or cam. and the cam comes with v959 is really good for its price. ;)

A foot note: using t9x fly the v959 it is so solid, I can zoom through 2 1/2 ft gap like without thinking in my house. not with the stock tx. That tells me what a difference between the stock tx and T9X. we need to get all these 'toys' models to be able to flown by T9X. This little bugger flies better than my quad 450. ;) Very solid.
Last edited by kaos on Wed Apr 03, 2013 9:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: "Flip" button on Syma X1/WLToys v949

Post by Hippo » Wed Apr 03, 2013 8:52 pm

I have the same interest. I have the v999, which has the grappling hook, I'd love to be able to raise and lower the hook from my real transmitter.

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Re: "Flip" button on Syma X1/WLToys v949

Post by JohnEdwa » Wed Apr 03, 2013 9:01 pm

It seems WLtoys is going to drop the FlySky completely, and go with whatever protocol the v202 uses for all of their new quads ("BK2423" and "nRF24L01").
The reason being that FlySky can't make reliable accelerometers... so they are going to release the V949 as v212, and V959 as v222, but both of these new models will be 6axis models, meaning both a gyro and an accelerometer. Interestingly, these new boards are made by.. LG!

There is currently no module whatsoever for this protocol, and I don't know if there ever will, unless the community makes one.
Or if we make enough noise and get WLtoys to make one...

[EDIT]
victzh has managed to port the v202/v212/v222 protocol to work with arduino and maybe soon with deviation, but it has some hardware problems to fix.
http://www.deviationtx.com/forum/protoc ... 2-protocol
Last edited by JohnEdwa on Sat Apr 06, 2013 5:35 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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Re: "Flip" button on Syma X1/WLToys v949

Post by ShowMaster » Wed Apr 03, 2013 9:10 pm

I have a question?
With all the talk on FPV sites about super super antenna mods and designs, what about adding one to the RX or tx for these quads?
I'm not ready to tear into mine yet but may later when I've had enough fun. There's the 6 and 9 db gain tx antenna, patch antennas, and even add on boosters. All these if they indeed do increase range even at the sacrifice of losing 360 deg coverage, would let the quad fly farther and also preserve the flip, led and camera control that that we lose when using a stock 9x.
Doubling the range would probably match the battery flying time.
SM



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Re: "Flip" button on Syma X1/WLToys v949

Post by blackmoon » Wed Apr 17, 2013 4:41 pm

Could someone explain why in the schematics the RX/PD0 pin is tied to ICP1/PB0 ?

And how would one use the DEBUG1/DEBUG2 pins ?

Than you.

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Re: "Flip" button on Syma X1/WLToys v949

Post by th9xer » Tue Apr 23, 2013 12:27 pm

Apologies all for the lack of replies. I stopped getting the email notifications for new replies, probably my fault for reading a new post when not logged in, then forgetting to check again, sorry.

Some answers:

Q: Can it support xxx model ?
A: If it uses the A7105 chipset then with some software work, yes. However if it's a new protocol and therefore the protocol requires decoding then either you are going to have to do it yourself and code it yourself or buy me one of the models to examine. ** SEE NOTE BELOW

Q: So how long to decode a protocol if I buy you a model ?
A: You might be quicker to do it yourself.

Q: But I don't know any programming or electronics.
A: Probably still quicker to do it yourself.

Q: What about supporting other chipsets ?
A: I personally have no need for other chipsets at the minute so right now it's low priority. ** SEE NOTE BELOW

** NOTE
If however the protocol and chipset code already exists in deviation firmware it is much easier to port over, but to test it I would still need a sample of the model in question. The code can be ported without testing but runs a high risk of being useless, to the point where it is not worth spending time on it in the first place.

Q: How would one use the DEBUG1/DEBUG2 pins ?
A: They currently just toggle to show various timing within the software, for use on an oscilloscope.

Q: Why in the schematics the RX/PD0 pin is tied to ICP1/PB0 ?
A: To allow a more advanced serial protocol to talk to the module. Note the schematics are in a state of flux right now, and this feature might never get implemented in software.

Q: When will PCBs be available.
A: Sorry I'll pull my finger out and hopefully get them ordered in 1-2 weeks.

Q: How much for a PCB ?
A: Not sure yet, not much, around 5-6GBP each I imagine.

Q: How much for postage ?
A: I'll have to check weights and get back to you. I will keep it simple and offer one cost regardless of location.

Q: Can I get one ready soldered ?
A: No.

Q: Can I get a kit ?
A: No.

Q: What's new ?
A: Tried the AliExpress A7105 500m module and it works fine.
A: Changed to hardware SPI. (uncommitted yet).

Cam.

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Re: "Flip" button on Syma X1/WLToys v949

Post by Kilrah » Tue Apr 23, 2013 12:50 pm

I built myself one with an adruino nano and my A7105 module, flashed with the supplied HEX for Hubsan X4, it seems to bind fine with my X4 (LEDs stop flashing when I power the module on and supply a PPM signal), however I have no control (got the trottle to respond a couple of times for a second or so and then nothing more). Haven't checked in detail yet.

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Re: "Flip" button on Syma X1/WLToys v949

Post by th9xer » Tue Apr 23, 2013 1:57 pm

Hmm maybe break the link between RX/PD0 and ICP1/PB0, it could be the unimplemented PD0 pin holding the other low.

From memory if you get the Tx Rx switch on order wrong you get the solid lights but no control. Guess you have tried that though.

Cam.

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Re: "Flip" button on Syma X1/WLToys v949

Post by blackmoon » Tue Apr 23, 2013 9:28 pm

Thanks for the reply Cam.

@Kilrah

Could this be the cause (if the code was pulled before PB patched it).

http://www.deviationtx.com/forum/6-gene ... 4?start=20

Specially post #7578

http://www.deviationtx.com/forum/6-gene ... rt=20#7578

Patch on Bitbucket ?

PhracturedBlue 5b5a0db Fix for hubsan protocol 2013-03-10

https://bitbucket.org/PhracturedBlue/de ... 0aaea1e823

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Re: "Flip" button on Syma X1/WLToys v949

Post by th9xer » Tue Apr 23, 2013 10:03 pm

Good find, it would explain why mine works but not Kilrah's. I'll port the code over tomorrow.

Thanks for that.

Cam.

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Re: "Flip" button on Syma X1/WLToys v949

Post by akkuschrauber » Wed Apr 24, 2013 12:04 am

Hi,
now if any want, I can tell that my (my wifes) Hubsan X4 is perfectly working with r14 of Cam's hard and software working on my beloved th9x with er9x and OpenTx.
Great work Cam, specialy for the ready compiled hex for my dead bug style module :D
Didn't tried r16 yet, but left the link between RX/PD0 and ICP1/PB0 beside and never missed it till now 8-)
Just bind, power model prior to tx off and opposite order on (1. tx - 2. model), no binding lost no failures afaik.
I did not made a range check yet, but I think within my home with all the lot of wifi / dect / etc. smoke (wifi got 250mW) it flies better than with stock tx.

Want some pictures ?
The one and only girlycopter in germany at the moment :o
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Hubsan-X4_rc-ppm2spi-r14_er9x-r788_eePe-r362.pdf
Model settings for er9x and OpenTx
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vero_module.jpg
nice eh :D
Hubsan-X4_04_with_TH9x.jpg
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Re: "Flip" button on Syma X1/WLToys v949

Post by Kilrah » Wed Apr 24, 2013 6:25 am

th9xer wrote:Good find, it would explain why mine works but not Kilrah's. I'll port the code over tomorrow.
OK, will try that!

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Re: "Flip" button on Syma X1/WLToys v949

Post by blackmoon » Wed Apr 24, 2013 9:17 pm

I'm using an old arduino pro mini (5V/16mhz) and a XL-7105-SY to make this module.

I'm powering the pro micro with 3.3V (I know it's out of specs but should work) so I can eliminate the level converter from the circuit.

Can I just not connect the DIO_PULLD since I don't use the level converter ?

Thank you.
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Re: "Flip" button on Syma X1/WLToys v949

Post by th9xer » Wed Apr 24, 2013 10:47 pm

Yes blackmoon leaving DIO_PULLD disconnected should be fine. However in the next version of the code I am going to switch to hardware based SPI so direct pin to pin connection will not be possible when powering the CPU @ 3.3V. With hardware SPI the IO lines are separate and need to be combined. I suspect a 1k ish resistor in series with the MOSI pin before it joins the MISO line would do the trick.

Incidentaly 3.3V @ 16Mhz is quite a way off spec. I do believe others have tried it and failed but I stand to be corrected, never tried it myself though, amaze me !!!

Hubsan fix as suggested over at deviation has been commited. Untested !

Cam.

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Re: "Flip" button on Syma X1/WLToys v949

Post by blackmoon » Thu Apr 25, 2013 2:36 pm

As I only have one old spare pro mini, I'll use the code you just committed.

But I'll keep an eye on your hardware implementation.

Is it safer even with the software implementation as it is and 3.3v, to place a resistor between the module lines and the mcu ?

Anyway, thank you for porting this code.

I'm doing this for a friend, I have a devo10+deviation that I use for my hubsan.

I'll try to amaze you :D , but I'm hopping as well that this will work.

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Re: "Flip" button on Syma X1/WLToys v949

Post by th9xer » Thu Apr 25, 2013 10:10 pm

All understood blackmoon. Please let me know if the fix works ?

Cam.

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Re: "Flip" button on Syma X1/WLToys v949

Post by Kilrah » Fri Apr 26, 2013 5:07 am

OK, I've flashed the new Hubsan .hex, my X4 still doesn't seem to agree :(

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Re: "Flip" button on Syma X1/WLToys v949

Post by th9xer » Sat Apr 27, 2013 5:54 pm

Oh dear. This post over on Deviation spotted by Blackmoon refers to this commit:
https://bitbucket.org/PhracturedBlue/de ... 0aaea1e823

Which is exactly what I added to the code.

My code is based (currently) on a snapshot after this commit https://bitbucket.org/PhracturedBlue/de ... d972dd8e00

There are other changes in the code between these commits and the current code:
1) The addition of time out periods to stop infinite loops. I doubt these are the cause.
2) Setting the Tx power level. Again can't see these being the cause, but I'll add them in.

Failing 2) being the cause I think further investigation of your circuit Kilrah might be a good idea.

I would prefer to only add the code for 1) if all else fails.

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Re: "Flip" button on Syma X1/WLToys v949

Post by blackmoon » Mon Apr 29, 2013 5:06 pm

One more question,

The bind button works like other modules ?

i.e. push while powering on the transmitter ?

Because this can be a pita,

(It is the same with the wltoys V939, biding each time you change battery is really annoying, because you don't have much time to do it. I stoped using my V939 because of having to try the bind 5 times in a row before being fast enough to achieve it.)

If this the right behavior, why not implement the following (if feasible) :

Ditch the bind button and auto bind at power up like the rtf toys transmitters do it.

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Re: "Flip" button on Syma X1/WLToys v949

Post by th9xer » Mon Apr 29, 2013 5:54 pm

Having never owned the V939 you will have to forgive the ignorance, but what you propose is just like sticking the bind button down ? So at every switch on the Tx enters bind mode ?

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Re: "Flip" button on Syma X1/WLToys v949

Post by ReSt » Mon Apr 29, 2013 5:58 pm

And never leave bind mode.

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Re: "Flip" button on Syma X1/WLToys v949

Post by blackmoon » Mon Apr 29, 2013 8:47 pm

Not quite that, the rtf transmitter that come with these quads enter bind mode when switched on, then after say 10sec they go on with normal mode of operation.

The HT8 module for the Hisky/WLTOYS/Hobbyking FBL100 and FF120, Hobbyking Q-bot does the same, it enters bind mode when powered up then after some time switches to normal (connected) mode.

What I don't know is if the RX sends something back to the TX to instruct it that bind was successful and normal operation can be entered, or if it is just a matter of waiting say 10 sec for the rx to bind.

I assume from the lack of reply on the matter, that bind should be done like any other module : hold bind while powering up transmitter.


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