Simulator Jack

General mods that are considered worth doing; regardless of the end firmware you use.
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agusta600gt
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Simulator Jack

Post by agusta600gt » Tue Jan 10, 2012 10:51 pm

hello everyone.
im searching for the proper Jack for connecting the T9X with a simulator.

Do i need a Mono or Stereo Jack...? Can someone provide a wiring diagram please ?

is there a way to fit a USB plug?...i mean from jack to usb

cheers ;)

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Re: Simulator Jack

Post by Rob Thomson » Wed Jan 11, 2012 6:53 am

Slope Soaring, FPV, and pretty much anything 'high tech'
...........if you think it should be in the wiki.. ask me for wiki access, then go add it!

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agusta600gt
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Re: Simulator Jack

Post by agusta600gt » Wed Jan 11, 2012 11:53 am

Thanks...but i already ordered one at HK ;)

but i just waanna know if its only a mono or stereo jack....dx6i uses a stereo one so :?

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Crucial
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Re: Simulator Jack

Post by Crucial » Wed Jan 11, 2012 8:25 pm

It is a mono jack although some stereo cables have been known to work ok.

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ShowMaster
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Re: Simulator Jack

Post by ShowMaster » Tue Feb 21, 2012 5:12 pm

Although many stereo cables will work in a mono jack, there can be issues if the 3 conductor surface area on the plug is off slightly from the mono jacks contact design. A mono plugs 2 conductor surface area will mate properly with a mono jacks contact. I find that many stereo plugs are more tapered at the tip than the more blunt mono plug.
Spekturm uses a mono trainer jack,and a mono trainer cable for all model TXs. The 9x seems to be designed as a mono jack/plug trainer as well as it works that way.
http://www.spektrumrc.com/Products/Defa ... Id=SPM6805
For the above reasons I use mono cables.
SM


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jhsa
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Re: Simulator Jack

Post by jhsa » Tue Feb 21, 2012 5:37 pm

I tried with a stereo and it works fine.. but if it was designed for a mono, then use a mono..
Simple as that :mrgreen:
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Re: Simulator Jack

Post by Westy » Tue Feb 21, 2012 7:24 pm

Sounds like a good plan to me

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Re: Simulator Jack

Post by ShowMaster » Thu Feb 23, 2012 3:43 am

While we're talking about trainer jacks and 9x,
I posted a while back somewhere that gruvin posted a level changer 1 transistor fix so other brand TXs could be used as the student box on the 9x.
The 9x wants to see a 5v ptp PPM input and outputs 5v PTP PPM. Most other brand TXs output 2v PTP PPM and won't drive the 9X.
This I've varrified and after doing the mod I can use a JR and DX7 as the trainer now. I posted that I was going to wire the circuit in a external mini box with battery so that the internal mod would not have to be installed since it does require cutting trace as well as installing the circuit.
I think Mike B sugested that I only had to use a single Schottky Diode to make this work. I tried several ideas with no luck. So if Mike or anyone else has more ideas or details, or has it working, please post it. I will build the external transistor circuit to try next to see if it will work.
I'm trying to keep the internal 9x mods to a minimum to keep it simple for all. Of course my 2 9Xs work just fine stock but that's not the idea here.
SM
Last edited by ShowMaster on Thu Feb 23, 2012 4:26 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Simulator Jack

Post by Westy » Thu Feb 23, 2012 4:00 am

Hmmmm ..... wonder if you can set it up so that is can do both by switching it from one to the other?

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Re: Simulator Jack

Post by ShowMaster » Thu Feb 23, 2012 4:44 am

Please clarify your comment.
I think your asking if the 9x can be the trainer to let's say a dx7?
I'll try it with a stock 9X as the trainer and my DX7 to see if any level conversion is needed in that direction. The 9x er9x FW allows the 9x PPM to be inverted so only level should be in question. 
Maybe someone here has used a stock 9x as a trainer to a non 9X TX and will post the results and save me some time brainstorming.
SM

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Re: Simulator Jack

Post by Westy » Thu Feb 23, 2012 7:21 am

is it me you are addressing???

What I am saying is .... if you can modify it by increasing the resistance to get it down to 2V ... then could you put together a small circuit to route the supply to a 2 way switch of some kind .... so you can have one setting to normal TDX connect with other Same brand 9x units ... and then you can switch it for JR Router the power through the higher resisitor?

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Re: Simulator Jack

Post by jhsa » Thu Feb 23, 2012 7:51 am

the problem as I understand is not the 9x receiving 5V. that's ok.. the problem is that the other radio's PPM level is not high enough to drive the master 9x. if you put resistors you'll make things worse ;) :)
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Re: Simulator Jack

Post by ShowMaster » Thu Feb 23, 2012 8:09 am

Hi Westy, yes I was trying to answer your post.
To repeat what I'm saying,

All models of the 9x TX trainer jack  output and also want an input trainer signal of 5 volts peak to peak.
Most other major brands of TXs work at 2 v signals. A 1 transistor level changer is an easy way to do that and it works. It does invert the inputed data to the 9X but if you use a Frsky module the polarity is not an issue. The Frsky module deals with it and makes it correct. If you stay with the original stock 9x module the input trainer signal will have to be inverted a second time to make it like the original except it's been converted to 5 volts.
Going the other way, using the 9X as the trainer to a non 9X master is what I need to work on. The 9X 5v trainer output may be OK or maybe it'll have to be level converted to 2 volts as well as inverted. This can't be done with just a resistor, it'll need a transistor or two. If er9x. FW is loaded the trainer PPM out can be inverted in the menu I think.
I'll get it call working both ways with several brands of TXs and than I'll post my results. I'm hoping others, like Gruvin have already done if both ways and will comment. I'll be back when I have some answers.
SM
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MikeB
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Re: Simulator Jack

Post by MikeB » Thu Feb 23, 2012 9:21 am

Er9x receives the trainer signal in either polarity, and sends it back out to the module using the polarity defined, so the stock module should work regardless of the polarity of the PPM-in signal.

Mike.
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Re: Simulator Jack

Post by Westy » Thu Feb 23, 2012 9:27 am

Sounds good people.... get back to us with your results ... will be very interesting to see what solutions there are

Cheers
Westy

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Re: Simulator Jack

Post by ShowMaster » Thu Feb 23, 2012 6:42 pm

Re ppm polarity Mike,
I was asked about using another brand TX as a trainer for a stock 9x as well.
Not part of this fourm but may require a non inverting option in a external trainer cable level changer interface.
I'll get to that ASAP with a new sock 9x as well as er9x and added Frsky options to see what works with what.
I think you mentioned in a post about the Schotkky Diode simple interface? If so please explain more on how you think it will work.
SM

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Re: Simulator Jack

Post by ShowMaster » Fri Feb 24, 2012 4:47 pm

Ok, stumped?
Try as I will I can't seem to convert the Spektrum 2-3 v ptp PPM level to 5 V ptp to intuit into my 9x?
I used to be good, oh well.
I have 1 9x with Gruvins internal level changer circuit and it works great. Tried it externally but no go.
Any ideas or circuits to try are welcome.
I want to be able to externally use any brand RX as a master or trainer by simply setting this inline box for the levels in and out and polarity in needed. Sounds simple I thought.
I see this as worthwhile for teaching with so many brand radios showing up. I hate handing the TX off to teach.
The common PPMs seem to be 2-3 v PTP where our stock 9x in and out is 5V ptp.
A test with my DX7 was OK when the stock 9X is the trainer. Not OK when the DX7 was the trainer and 9X master FYI.
My 9X with Gruvins internal circuit works both ways.
Maybe opto isolation would be a good idea as well if the external power source can be common, or 2 batteries?
SM

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Re: Simulator Jack

Post by wilco1967 » Fri Feb 24, 2012 7:33 pm

i've used the methode in this link

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showpost ... count=6064

works fine with a Mx-12 (same as JR) as a slave....

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ShowMaster
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Re: Simulator Jack

Post by ShowMaster » Fri Feb 24, 2012 10:55 pm

Re circuit diagram. This is very close to Gruvins and installed in the 4066 line. I'm using that on the 9x that works with the Spekturm now. I'm trying to use gruvins externally so that it won't require cutting the trace inside.
I tried it externally but not this exact circuit and couldn't get it to work?
Any ideas on using this circuit externally and power required?
I'll breadboard this circuit up over the next few days and try again,
Thank you for your input.
SM
Last edited by ShowMaster on Fri Mar 02, 2012 6:03 am, edited 1 time in total.

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MikeB
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Re: Simulator Jack

Post by MikeB » Fri Feb 24, 2012 11:42 pm

The single schottky diode solution may be a bit optimistic.
For imformation, the input pin needs to see 1.0V or less for a logic 0, and 3.0V or more for a logic 1, a voltage swing of 2 volts minimum. The pin includes an internal pull-up resistor (to 5V) of value between 20K and 50K.
If I get a chance (HaHa - need some of that free time Erazz was looking for), I'll do some testing myself.

Mike.
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Re: Simulator Jack

Post by MojoMaestro » Fri Feb 24, 2012 11:48 pm

Augusta,
Maybe U wanna use it for a bit of Sim.
Let's say U r using Phoenix RC Sim and that's why U need a plug like that.
I use Phoenix too for about 1.5 years, i love it.
The plug U need has "USB to mono", i made a quick Google search for example :
http://www.rctoys.com/rc-toys-and-parts ... IRING.html

THIS is the one, i tried to play Phoenix with multi Sim and it did not work for me.
Then how will U get the specific Dongle for the Phoenix Sim.
If so, i got a link for that....
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ShowMaster
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Re: Simulator Jack external ppm level changer

Post by ShowMaster » Fri Mar 02, 2012 6:15 am

I tried a 4069 hex inverter externally and it is my new low part count design that's working on my breadboard. I have the option of converting my dx7 ppm from 2 v PTP to 4.5v PTP and a stock er9x TX likes the ppm signal. I also have the option of inverting or a non inverted ppm out due to the 4069's other sections. I need a 5 v power source and after I read the current draw I'll decide my options.
A 4049 may be a better choice because it can take an input better than VDD and has a TTL fan out of 2.
I'm rusty in this area but the 4049 seems to be used for actual level conversion so I'll pick one up.
$.17 at my local surplus store. Only $4.30 per gal gas to drive the 6 mile round trip in my SUV.
Better buy 2 ha ha.
SM

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Re: Simulator Jack

Post by LTMNO » Fri Feb 06, 2015 9:19 pm

Wow.. its been a while since there was a post here..
I have a question. I have purhcased the AeroSIM RC Simulator..
It comes with a USB to Mono Jack.
When I plug it into the radio.. the radio powers up... screen wise.. is that normal?
Is that what is suppose to happy... sorry for the silly question... i have never done this before?
Custom 9x with M64/Telemetry Mod

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MikeB
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Re: Simulator Jack

Post by MikeB » Fri Feb 06, 2015 9:47 pm

Quite normal. The radio also detects this mode of operation and switches to sending the PPM data stream out on the jack instead of receiving the trainer input.

Mike.
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LTMNO
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Re: Simulator Jack

Post by LTMNO » Sat Feb 07, 2015 1:16 am

Thanks Mike, I just wanted to be sure... I thought since the winter wont let up here in Canada.. I would try to fly a simulator. ;-)
Have a great weekend!
Custom 9x with M64/Telemetry Mod

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