Reversing Aileron Stick After Taranis Gimbal Upgrade

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9XTremist
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Reversing Aileron Stick After Taranis Gimbal Upgrade

Post by 9XTremist »

As the below pic shows, rudder and elevator reversed. The throttle was reversed on a different screen. I did the rud and ele but can't get the aileron channel to highlight. I don't know the scheme to move the highlight I just luckily got the ryud and ele channels reversed. Maybe someone can tell me the proper method to the madness. Neither the er9x manual or the ersky9x explained manual had this specific screen showing. The ersky9x explained said once the cursor is there hit mode to highlight. That does nothing. The
left and right buttons move the highlight but not to the far right and after 2 presses it jumps around weirdly

thanks,
stuck on stupid
Sun Feb 21, 2016 - 00-06-36.png
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Re: Reversing Aileron Stick After Taranis Gimbal Upgrade

Post by jhsa »

First question. Why are you trying to reverse the sticks in the Hardware menu? Did you replace the original 9x gimbals with some different ones??
Neither the er9x manual or the ersky9x explained manual had this specific screen showing.
Here is from the er9x manual. You didn't look in the right place. Remember, Er9x is similar to Ersky9x but it has some differences.. ;)
"Stick Reverse
If the stock stick assemblies are replaced with a different type (such as Taranis or Aurora 9 gimbals),
one or more stick axes may work in directions opposite to the associated trims. The Stick Reverse
function is provided purely to correct this situation. To use it, highlight the stick diagram. Pressing
[LEFT] or [RIGHT] will then cycle through the 16 different possibilities, with reversed sticks shown on
a dark background. The picture above shows “Rud” and “Ele” sticks reversed.
To return to the normal state with no sticks reversed, press [LEFT] repeatedly. Use this feature ONLY
to correct sticks that are electrically reversed. Do NOT use it to reverse control directions"
Second question. If the answer to the above question is YES and the text from the er9x manual didn't help you, what version of the firmware do you have installed on your radio?

If the answer to my first question is NO and you are trying to reverse the channel direction using the Hardware menu, then please DON'T. The limits menu or the mixer are the correct place to do that ;) :)

As the manual text above says, the hardware menu is only to be used when there are Hardware changes and not for normal programming of the radio..

I hope this helps.

João
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Re: Reversing Aileron Stick After Taranis Gimbal Upgrade

Post by 9XTremist »

When I looked at the er9x manual I looked under the heading "Hardware" since I was in the hardware menu on the tx. Should have let my gaze drift up 3 inches to "STICK REVERSE".
My first mistake was reversing the throttle on the other screen and after coming to the stick reverse screen and pushing the right button about 3 times it would highlight the throttle and I would chicken out and go back. I had no idea there were 16 presets, I was trying to move left or right and then hit mode to highlight and select, since that was what the "ersk9x explained" manual said to do. ha. I need to un-reverse the throttle on the other screen and go through the presets until all 4 channels are blacked out.

Your last sentence says "I hope this helps"
I was hoping you were here and would save me from myself.
Sure enough.
Thanks

After doing the calibration earlier I noticed a new pot indicator on the right (in the pic below but wasn't red) just as I was exiting the calibration. What could that be? I did not notice it earlier than earlier when I did the first of 2 calibrations tonight.
Sun Feb 21, 2016 - 01-39-00.png
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Re: Reversing Aileron Stick After Taranis Gimbal Upgrade

Post by jhsa »

9XTremist wrote: I need to un-reverse the throttle on the other screen and go through the presets until all 4 channels are blacked out.
No, negative.. If you have the original 9x gimbals you need to un-reverse the throttle on the other screen (please let us know which screen) , then go to stick reverse in Hardware, and keep pressing [LEFT] to un-select all sticks..

The hardware is there ONLY for when you make hardware changes to your system. Do not used it to reverse stuff. That is done in the normal menus..

After doing the calibration earlier I noticed a new pot indicator on the right (in the pic below but wasn't red) just as I was exiting the calibration. What could that be? I did not notice it earlier than earlier when I did the first of 2 calibrations tonight.
I enabled pot 5 on my radio but it is not displaying anywhere. What version of the fw do you have installed??

Sorry, didn't realize you were talking about the calibration menu.. Yes, that is pot 5 there.. maybe Mike intended to place it in the middle.. If so, it might be a little bug ;)
Sorry for the confusion..
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Re: Reversing Aileron Stick After Taranis Gimbal Upgrade

Post by 9XTremist »

I think if you read the title of my post or the subject of my post ...
I kept thinking he will see the title and all will be good.

btw - as for pot 5 in calibration, there is nothing to turn or adjust to calibrate is there?
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Re: Reversing Aileron Stick After Taranis Gimbal Upgrade

Post by jhsa »

9XTremist wrote:I think if you read the title of my post or the subject of my post ...
I kept thinking he will see the title and all will be good.
Ha ha ha ha ha.. :mrgreen: SOOOORRYYYYYY.. :mrgreen:
I keep doing that lately ;) :) but this time was really in front of me :D I normally focus more on the text though...

Anyway, the info I wrote is good for new people that might read this.. and have a laugh at the same time :)

Yes, after installing the new gimbals you might have to reverse a couple of sticks in the hardware menu.. ;)
btw - as for pot 5 in calibration, there is nothing to turn or adjust to calibrate is there?
Well, did you install another pot or slider on your radio? Then you assigned Pot 5 to it?
Not sure I understand your question..

Sorry again. :)

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Re: Reversing Aileron Stick After Taranis Gimbal Upgrade

Post by 9XTremist »

no worries, if I read as many post as you have and answered as many help questions as you have I'd be brain dead and drooling on myself. You (and a few others) are truly the man in the trench, day after day, since I first discovered er9x in 2009(?) erazz, you, mike and steve. I'm grateful cause I'd have to have a drool bucket under my chin, like Belushi had to empty.

pot 5, it's tied to ext 1, I thought it was for volume control that was assigned to a pot. It was either you or Mike told me and showmaster about it or show told me. Hell, I've blinked since then and I haven't turned this radio on for almost a month until today when I did the t-gimbals. I'm still trying to read and learn enough from the manuals to actually set it up enough to get to use it for the first time so I don't have to bother someone with questions on how to do this or how to do that. one step forward, two steps back.
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Re: Reversing Aileron Stick After Taranis Gimbal Upgrade

Post by 9XTremist »

When I release the elevator stick if I'm releasing from a positive number, stick in a climbing mode/pulled toward me it will return to zero every time. If I'm releasing from a diveing stick direction, stick away from me it will never zero it will read -1, -2 or -4 every time. Once in a while if you let it spring back on its own and it bounces it might read zero but not very often. I read a complaint at Aloft from a glider pilot about this very thing with the replacement gimbals. Anybody see this besides me? What can be done about it or to ease it some?

thanks
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Re: Reversing Aileron Stick After Taranis Gimbal Upgrade

Post by jhsa »

9XTremist wrote:You (and a few others) are truly the man in the trench, day after day, since I first discovered er9x in 2009(?) erazz, you, mike and steve.
Please allow me to add someone else to the list. Two Men that also love helping others. They are great people and have my greatest respect.. They just have to be mentioned. "Daedalus66" and "Showmaster".
pot 5, it's tied to ext 1, I thought it was for volume control that was assigned to a pot. It was either you or Mike told me and showmaster about it or show told me. Hell, I've blinked since then and I haven't turned this radio on for almost a month until today when I did the t-gimbals. I'm still trying to read and learn enough from the manuals to actually set it up enough to get to use it for the first time so I don't have to bother someone with questions on how to do this or how to do that. one step forward, two steps back.
Do you actually have a pot or slider connected to the EXT1 pin on the main board?

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Re: Reversing Aileron Stick After Taranis Gimbal Upgrade

Post by jhsa »

9XTremist wrote:When I release the elevator stick if I'm releasing from a positive number, stick in a climbing mode/pulled toward me it will return to zero every time. If I'm releasing from a diveing stick direction, stick away from me it will never zero it will read -1, -2 or -4 every time. Once in a while if you let it spring back on its own and it bounces it might read zero but not very often. I read a complaint at Aloft from a glider pilot about this very thing with the replacement gimbals. Anybody see this besides me? What can be done about it or to ease it some?

thanks
Try tightening the spring a bit more.. Those gimbals don't like loose sticks very much.. You will see that it will improve.

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Re: Reversing Aileron Stick After Taranis Gimbal Upgrade

Post by 9XTremist »

Naturally I would leave out 2 dedicated people.
No, no added hardware. I'll have to go to rcg and find the instructions that were given.
All 3 , rud ail and ele all have springs maxed out and I would put stronger springs if I thought the little tabs where you hook the springs would hold up and not snap off. It only does it on the one direction on the ele stick same as the glider pilot and another were complaining about at Aloft, which exchanged the one guys. I bought mine @ readymade rc so, who knows
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Re: Reversing Aileron Stick After Taranis Gimbal Upgrade

Post by jhsa »

9XTremist wrote: No, no added hardware. I'll have to go to rcg and find the instructions that were given.
So you didn't add any physical hardware to the radio, for example a Pot or a slider. Then of course it can't work ;)
If you need another pot for example, you will have to install another pot in the radio, connect one of the outer pins to 5V available on the 9x mainboard, 9 pin connector, the other outer pin of the pot to the Analog ground also available on the same connector , and the center pin from the pot (or wiper) you connect to the EXT 1 pin, also available on the connector.
Please see picture.
Only then you go to the hardware menu and enable POT 5 (or POT4) by selecting the pin the Pot is actually connected to the mainboard. In this case EXT 1.
Now you have a brand new working pot installed on your radio, after calibration of course ;) :D
On my picture I have my pot connected to EXT2 which is pin number 2 of that connector. I think (not sure) that EXT1 is pin number 3..
All 3 , rud ail and ele all have springs maxed out and I would put stronger springs if I thought the little tabs where you hook the springs would hold up and not snap off. It only does it on the one direction on the ele stick same as the glider pilot and another were complaining about at Aloft, which exchanged the one guys. I bought mine @ readymade rc so, who knows
If it reads -4 it is indeed a little too much. -0.4 would be ok.

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Re: Reversing Aileron Stick After Taranis Gimbal Upgrade

Post by Daedalus66 »

jhsa wrote:
9XTremist wrote:When I release the elevator stick if I'm releasing from a positive number, stick in a climbing mode/pulled toward me it will return to zero every time. If I'm releasing from a diveing stick direction, stick away from me it will never zero it will read -1, -2 or -4 every time. Once in a while if you let it spring back on its own and it bounces it might read zero but not very often. I read a complaint at Aloft from a glider pilot about this very thing with the replacement gimbals. Anybody see this besides me? What can be done about it or to ease it some?

thanks
Try tightening the spring a bit more.. Those gimbals don't like loose sticks very much.. You will see that it will improve.

João
But don't expect perfection. Adding a little deadband (Hardware menu) might help.

This kind of accuracy is still better than most servos.
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Re: Reversing Aileron Stick After Taranis Gimbal Upgrade

Post by 9XTremist »

jhsa,
I don't know why pot 5 was set to EXT 1. (I suspect a gremlins) I now know why it was showing up on the calibration screen. My volume control is actually set to pot 1.
Thanks for solving my reversal problem.

btw - it was -4/10ths (-0.4) not "-4.0", sorry
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Re: Reversing Aileron Stick After Taranis Gimbal Upgrade

Post by jhsa »

-0.4 is perfectly ok in my opinion.
About P5, if you don't have a physical pot connected to EXT1 and you selected it in the Hardware menu, the Pot will show as active but it won't work.
In this case set it to "NONE", which I believe you might already ha e done :)
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Re: Reversing Aileron Stick After Taranis Gimbal Upgrade

Post by Daedalus66 »

Anything less than 1 is good.
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Re: Reversing Aileron Stick After Taranis Gimbal Upgrade

Post by MikeB »

Note that the values go from -100.0 to +100.0, a range of 2000 steps. So a value of 0.4 is only 4 parts in 2000.
You are only noticing this because it is displayed.
Suppose the stick controls a moving surface on the 'plane that has a 20mm up and down movement (40mm total). A 0.4 value translates to a movement on the surface of 0.08mm, assuming the servo can resolve this and the linkage doesn't allow this much movement due to 'slop'.

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Re: Reversing Aileron Stick After Taranis Gimbal Upgrade

Post by jhsa »

There are a few guys that might say they can notice that :mrgreen:

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Re: Reversing Aileron Stick After Taranis Gimbal Upgrade

Post by 9XTremist »

Mike,
You are correct, that is the only reason i notice it is because it's on the numerical output screen. It doesn't show on the graphical output screen. (lack of resolution) When adding deadband should it make a difference as to the reading on the numerical output screen or just to the servo itself? (if the number is big enough) I have it set to "4" now and tried "8" and it didn't change what was shown on the numerical screen. It could be OCD but, I would like to know how it works or is supposed to work.
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Re: Reversing Aileron Stick After Taranis Gimbal Upgrade

Post by MikeB »

The best place to check the deadband function is the DIAGANA screen as this shows the stick value, while the "numeric output" screen shows the channels as processed by the mixers.

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Re: Reversing Aileron Stick After Taranis Gimbal Upgrade

Post by 9XTremist »

will do, thanks
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Re: Reversing Aileron Stick After Taranis Gimbal Upgrade

Post by 9XTremist »

Mike,
The stick values are almost the same as on the numeric screen. I set the deadband in the (hardware) deadband screen to "4" and then to "15" and it showed "-0.1 to -0.4" (diagana) and on the numeric screen "-0.1 to -0.7" (post mixer)

What I don't understand is when returning from a "pushed" stick position (down elevator) which is a positive value, it goes past center and reads a negative value which is a value that is given in a pulled stick situation. It only does this when returning from a pushed stick, it doesn't do this when the stick is pulled. Could one spring be slightly stronger than the other? Should I back off the tension a little, could it be pulling it past center? Usually when letting the stick bounce it will read zero and only shows this when returning it by hand. I would try backing off on the tension without asking but I have had the back off 1/2 a dozen times and won't press my luck with the screw post unless needed. According to Aloft they (FrSky) will replace gimbals with anything greater than a 0.5 to -0.5 value. After cutting the wires to install, these are void.
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Re: Reversing Aileron Stick After Taranis Gimbal Upgrade

Post by MikeB »

There is only one spring for the centering.
If you have the centre position consistently negative, you might repeat the calibration operation.

If you set the deadband value to 15, this should have had an effect on the value displayed, I just checked on my 9Xtreme. Please double check you have set the correct deadband value, e.g. for the right stick as elevator this the the RV (Right Vertical) entry.

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Re: Reversing Aileron Stick After Taranis Gimbal Upgrade

Post by 9XTremist »

Maybe I saw some replacement Taranis replacement springs and they were giving 4 of them or something but there are only 1 per axis. Yep, I was on the 3rd one down, "RV". I changed it back to "2 then to 3" and now it's reading right on both the numeric and the diagana screens. This time I immediately hit exit instead of navigating backwards to a point where I had to hit exit to change categories. It had to be implementing the changes without hitting exit immediately because when I would come back to the deadband screen the value I had previously implemented was showing. I can't find what it says in the manual for saving changes , at the moment but it's working.

I use 65MG's and they have a 4µs deadband, if -100 to +100 = 2000 steps what would 4µs be in steps? Or there other variables involved?

thanks for your time,
michael
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Re: Reversing Aileron Stick After Taranis Gimbal Upgrade

Post by jhsa »

I'm not sure if I calculated correctly, but I think 4uS is around 0.4%?

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Re: Reversing Aileron Stick After Taranis Gimbal Upgrade

Post by 9XTremist »

Thanks.
Thank you to Mike, Daedalus66 and you João.
Stick a fork in this one.
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Re: Reversing Aileron Stick After Taranis Gimbal Upgrade

Post by MikeB »

The 2000 steps cover 1mS, so 0.5uS per step. A 4uS deadband on the servo is therefore 0.8 on the stick.

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Re: Reversing Aileron Stick After Taranis Gimbal Upgrade

Post by jhsa »

So, my calculations were wrong then.. :) Not surprised :mrgreen:
I wasn't wrong by much though :) :mrgreen:
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Re: Reversing Aileron Stick After Taranis Gimbal Upgrade

Post by 9XTremist »

Couldn't tell by me. One of the attributes of being gullible.
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Re: Reversing Aileron Stick After Taranis Gimbal Upgrade

Post by jonathanyeo »

Guys,

sorry for highjacking this post....but I really have an issue that I need to reverse the hardware stock. I dont see any where in hardware screen to reverse the stick...I need to reverse the ALieron and rudder stick on Mod 1...as you see in video : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2pLNphr ... e=youtu.be

and yes, I have a new gimbal . Jeti installed.

This is what I see on the hardware menu screen...no stick reverse ?

Jonathan
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