Taranis Gimals in a 9X

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volumax
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Re: Taranis Gimals in a 9X

Post by volumax »

Im guessing they are amplified these were basically the first gimbals

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bob195558
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Re: Taranis Gimals in a 9X

Post by bob195558 »

Hi Volumax,
I have just installed new Taranis gimbals in another rc-member's 9xt radio which I had installed earlier the smartieparts Programmer Board Rev 2.3
and TelemetrEZ Board and upgraded 5V regulator, HK back light and with the trim rebooting fix mods.
I had a lot of trouble with the HK-Turnigy original pots especially the throttle pots in 9xt Radios.
In this 9xt radio, several of the original gimbals pots were repaired pots and it maybe were able to stand up over many months of use with the upgrading of the 5V regulator.
I know this is not proof of keep the original pots from failing, but it dose allow proper power to run everything. (I think it maintain more stable voltages too)
These original repaired pots in this 9x radio were still working properly, but the owner wanted to upgrade to the Taranis gimbals.

I think the best thinking to what may be the failure cause, is a mechanical function of some sort.

Bob B.
Er9x on 9x radio, with Smartieparts Programmer and TelemetrEZ Board.
ErSky9x on Taranis, Sky9x, 9Xtreme radios.
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Zebaloo
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Re: Taranis Gimals in a 9X

Post by Zebaloo »

Hello All.

Due to a bad aileron pot in my 9x, i've ordered a pair of new frsky PR10 gimbal for my Taranis, and put the original ones in my 9x.
Physically everything went fine, the gimbals are in place, cables soldered and calibration done.
As i've read on this subject i have two channels inverted (Aileron and Elevator, i'm in mode 1), i've tried to tick the inverted channels in companion but it's still not working when i'm sending the parameters to my 9x.

The gimbals are the one delivered in the early batch of taranis, the 9x is a V1 motherboard, i'm running openTX-9X-2.0.17 in french, Companion 2.0.17 also.

I'm sure i've missed something to make it work, but i've checked and re-checked without any success...

Please give me some help to have my kids back on the simulator :p

Thank you for any of your answers.

EDIT : Tried on Er9x, it works fine... But as my Taranis is on open TX, as are all my models programmed on my 9x, i would like to have it working on open TX.

Laurent
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Re: Taranis Gimals in a 9X

Post by Reacher10 »

I replaced the aileron/elevator mode 2 and also have aileron reversed. I'm running the test version FW for the AR9X board. Whats the best way to correct this. I reversed the channel but the trim is still reversed which could do a number on me since I'm ready to maiden a 30cc Edge.

These are not amplified, well I don't think so based on the pictures I've seen of them.
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jhsa
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Re: Taranis Gimals in a 9X

Post by jhsa »

Best way, swap the two external wires of the pots. Flysky swapped the colors, don't ask me why :o :shock: :( But you can do it in the firmware, in Radio setup/controls. Download the er9x manual from below and go to the beginning of page 20. Look at the picture and read that page.

viewtopic.php?f=5&t=6473

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Reacher10
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Re: Taranis Gimals in a 9X

Post by Reacher10 »

Thanks Bud!, I changed it in the FW and it worked great.

OH wait, if I reverse the channel it does reverse the channel however it also reverses the trim....right trim gives the channel left trim when channel is inverted.

i'll switch the wires because i know that will cause a problem at some point in time.
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jhsa
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Re: Taranis Gimals in a 9X

Post by jhsa »

Where did you reverse the stick? The option I pointed you to reverses ONLY the stick, not the trim.
I have a radio with amplified gimbals and had to reverse 2 of the sticks. All is working fine..

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Re: Taranis Gimals in a 9X

Post by Reacher10 »

I did exactly what the manual said.

"If the stock stick assemblies are replaced with a different type (such as Taranis or Aurora 9 gimbals),
one or more stick axes may work in directions opposite to the associated trims. The Stick Reverse
function is provided purely to correct this situation. To use it, highlight the stick diagram. Pressing
[LEFT] or [RIGHT] will then cycle through the 16 different possibilities, with reversed sticks shown on
a dark background. The picture above shows “Rud” and “Ele” sticks reversed.
To return to the normal state with no sticks reversed, press [LEFT] repeatedly. Use this feature ONLY
to correct sticks that are electrically reversed. Do NOT use it to reverse control directions."


I tested it on the other AR9X, it has original sticks, and for sure it reverses the trim.

So when I reverse the original stick on radio #2 (AR9X) and do not invert the channel, the stick does reverse however the trim is reversed, meaning when Itrim the ailerons to the right they trim to the left. If I invert the channel with the stick reversed the trim is correct.

On radio #1 (AR9X) with the taranis gimbal (right stick mode 2) the stick is reversed however the trim works correctly. When I reverse the stick the trim is correct however when I invert the channel the trim is reversed (backwards).

I swapped the two outside wires and everything is working as it should.
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MikeB
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Re: Taranis Gimals in a 9X

Post by MikeB »

Very odd, I just tried this on an AR9X board. I just reversed the rudder stick and the trim continued to work in the same direction as before, now opposite to the stick.

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jhsa
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Re: Taranis Gimals in a 9X

Post by jhsa »

I never had that problem either :o

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Re: Taranis Gimals in a 9X

Post by Reacher10 »

try the aileron mode 2 and see what happens when you invert the channel.
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MikeB
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Re: Taranis Gimals in a 9X

Post by MikeB »

Still all OK. You say invert the channel, I'm not changing any channels, just the stick on the controls menu.

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Re: Taranis Gimals in a 9X

Post by Reacher10 »

I have to invert the channel on certain planes and always when on at least one channel when I use two channels for aileron servos and as well for two elevator servos.
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Re: Taranis Gimals in a 9X

Post by MikeB »

Still all seems correct.
I'm starting from a correctly working channel, mode 2, aileron.
If I invert the channel, both stick and trim drive the channel in the opposite direction to before.
If I go to the controls menu and reverse the stick, this then does operate the channel in the opposite direction to the trim, but the trim always remains operating in the same sense, reversing only if I invert the channel.

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Re: Taranis Gimals in a 9X

Post by Reacher10 »

I tested it by looking at the control surfaces to make sure what I was seeing on the screen was in fact not correct when I trimmed the plane.

I'll check it again real quick...yup, no doubt. when aileron stick is reversed and then aileron channel is inverted the trim is backwards on both radios.

I'll test the sky9 board...
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MikeB
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Re: Taranis Gimals in a 9X

Post by MikeB »

What is the Date/time on the firmware version screen? I don't think I've changed anything, but I need to check we are running the same firmware.

Please check with the aileron stick reversed, the "telltale" on the main screens moves in the same direction as the stick movement.

Please create a new model, and with the aileron stick still reversed, look on the 'bars" screen. Does the bar for the aileron channel move in the same direction for the aileron stick moving to the right and the right trim moving to the right?

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Re: Taranis Gimals in a 9X

Post by Reacher10 »

VERS: V.2278-MIKE
DATE: 29.09.2015
TIME: 11:31:15
SVN: ersky9x-r218
MOB: REVB

AR9X board with stock gimbals, new model aileron on channel 2 right hand gimbal (mode 2):
With the stick reversed the bar moves to the left when stick is moved to the right. right trim moves the bar to the right, trim indicator moves to the right.

With the stick reversed and the channel inverted bar moves to the right when stick is moved to the right. right trim moves the bar to the left, the trim indicator moves to the right.

The other radio with the right hand gimbal replaced with a taranis gimbal, outside wires switched, acts the same way.
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MikeB
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Re: Taranis Gimals in a 9X

Post by MikeB »

So on the stock gimbals, why have you reversed the stick? It shouldn't need to be reversed. Your description is exactly what I would expect if you have reversed the stick when it doesn't need reversing.
Which direction does the "telltale" move in relation to the stick?

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Re: Taranis Gimals in a 9X

Post by Reacher10 »

No, what happened Mike was that I replaced the original gimbal with the taranis gimbal with matching the wire colors posted here. The stick needed to be reversed so that it was correct however the trim then became reversed. I then went and swapped the outside wires and the stick direction was then correct so there was no longer a need to reverse the stick hence no longer a problem with the trim.

I then decided to check what happens when the right hand stick (aileron, Mode 2) is reversed on the radio with with stock gimbals. The radio doesn't know or care weather the stick needs to be reversed but for sure if you reverse that stick the trims do not work correctly if the channel it is controlling is inverted.

There is a problem with the trim when that stick is reversed and the channel is inverted.

Try it on an actual model, prop off...you will see that with the stick reversed and the channel inverted it will trim in the opposite direction than it is supposed to.
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Re: Taranis Gimals in a 9X

Post by jhsa »

Which screen are you looking at? the bars screen? that's the channels outputs. People normally get confused with sticks and channels. they are completely different things.. The manual explains it very well, if only people bothered to read it :(
You have to check on the sticks main screen.. the one with the squares and the little ball inside.. There the trim must move in the same direction as the stick..

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Re: Taranis Gimals in a 9X

Post by Reacher10 »

Yes João I understand completely. I will make a video tomorrow....there is a problem...screw the main screen...test it with a model. I know how to reverse the stick once you pointed me to it in the manual and I am not confusing it with a channel.
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Re: Taranis Gimals in a 9X

Post by MikeB »

The stick reverse option in the controls menu is exactly that, an option to reverse the stick ONLY, not the trim.
A stock Tx should all work correctly for both the trim and the stick.
If a gimbal is replaced, and then the stick is operating in the wrong direction, the trim will still be correct. This is the situation in which you need the stick reverse option ON.

It seems you are expecting the stick reverse to reverse the trim at the same time.

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Re: Taranis Gimals in a 9X

Post by jhsa »

I have a skyboard radio with the old amplified taranis gimbals. These MUST be reversed in the firmware because of the amplifier. Two sticks needed reversing. I tried reversing channels but all work as it should. The trims always follow the stick movement.
Please make a video as you said. Maybe we understand better what is going on. But please film also the inputs screen. The one with the squares and the little circles inside.

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Re: Taranis Gimals in a 9X

Post by Reacher10 »

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Re: Taranis Gimals in a 9X

Post by jhsa »

Everything is working as it should. I see no problem at all
When the sticks are wired correctly the trims follow the stick. When the sticks are not wired correctly, hence reversed, the trims DO NOT follow the stick.
This option was implemented to FIX an hardware problem introduced by the amplified gimbals.
If you change the wiring again from the aileron pot, the trim will be correct and the stick will not be correct and therrefore go in different directions. Now reverse the stick in the firmware and both trim and stick will go in the same direction, whatever the channel is inverted or not..
This is an HARDWARE FIX setting. Once the hardware is corrected by the software, this is to be left alone forever, or until you change the hardware again..

Mike, do you see now why I keep suggesting/insisting to move this setting to the hardware menu? at some point someone will think they are reversing channels and WILL crash his/her model.. This setting has to be hidden or it could get dangerous..

João

EDIT: By the way, Mike will be able to explain better than me why the radio is behaving as it should.. English is not my main language..
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Re: Taranis Gimals in a 9X

Post by MikeB »

That looks to be working "as designed". I do need to move the stick reverse to the hardware menu, as that is more what it is for. It is not for changing the control functionality, simply to reverse the stick (NOT trim) if a replacement stick operates in the wrong direction.

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Re: Taranis Gimals in a 9X

Post by jhsa »

And it is a good idea to hide the HW menu as well in my opinion.. No point in having settings there for safety if a child could go there and mess with the hardware settings ;)

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Re: Taranis Gimals in a 9X

Post by Reacher10 »

OK...when I wired up the NON amplified gimbal the stick was reversed. I inquired about correcting this and was pointed to the controls menu and reversing the stick. This worked but the trims were incorrect.

I then changed the wires and no longer needed to reverse the stick as it was then correct...trims and all.

So the stick reverse in the controls menu is only for amplified gimbals NOT the NON amplified gimbals?

So if one installs NON amplified gimbals and they are reversed the only fix for NON amplified gimbals is to change the two outside wires?
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Re: Taranis Gimals in a 9X

Post by MikeB »

Should work the same for amplified or non-amplified gimbals. I'm confused as to why you found the trims wrong when you first reversed the incorrect gimbal. Could you have reversed the wrong stick?

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Re: Taranis Gimals in a 9X

Post by Reacher10 »

Nope...the trims were wrong if I inverted the channel....that's how this whole thing started. The exact behavior you saw in the video was exactly what happened when I used the stick reverse to correct the stick...the trims were opposite. That's when I just changed the wires.

i just decided to investigate the stick reverse thing and like I said it shouln't matter weather the gimbal is wired correctly or not...the trims should always go in the same direction as the sticks. I still don't undersand how if the trims are opposite the sticks that this can be correct?

I didn't change the wiring on the trims, could this be the problem?

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