Buddy Box Question

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unlucky58
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Buddy Box Question

Post by unlucky58 »

Trying to set up a Turnigy 9X flashed to ER9X Ver r812 to work as master and using a JR F400 (simple 4 channel FM radio) as the slave. I set all the settings under general setting page 2/6 and turned trainer on for the selected model. Everything works for the master but no response from the JR radio when I pull the trainer switch. I saw some posts that suggested I need to build a signal enhancer circuit to get the JR to work as a slave. Is that true? If not does anyone have any suggestions as to what I may be doing wrong. If I need to build an enhancer circuit what is the recommended one? I have seen 3 or 4 different versions. This is for a 4 channel plane. Please let me know if you need more information. Thanks in advance.

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MikeB
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Re: Buddy Box Question

Post by MikeB »

On the trainer setup page, there are 4 values at the bottom of the display labelled "CAL".
These are the first 4 channels as received from the slave, whether or not any switch is active. If these are stuck at 0, and don't change when you move the sticks on the slave Tx, then you are not receiving the trainer input.

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unlucky58
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Re: Buddy Box Question

Post by unlucky58 »

Mike, sorry I should have posted that. The values are not changing. I know my trainer cord is good. I can get the F400 to work as a slave to my JR 8103. So, I'm stumped as to why it isn't working. I also did not make any changes to the 9X. I don't think one has to add the internal resistor anymore. Am I correct in that assumption? I am using the Frsky DJT module in the 9X. Maybe that makes a difference. Anyone have any ideas please let me know.
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Kilrah
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Re: Buddy Box Question

Post by Kilrah »

The signal output on the F400 could be too weak, as with the Spektrums.
Daedalus66
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Re: Buddy Box Question

Post by Daedalus66 »

You say the trainer cable is OK. Just to be sure, is it a proper trainer cable (mono) rather than an audio cable, which are often troublesome?

unlucky58
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Re: Buddy Box Question

Post by unlucky58 »

Yes, it is a mono cable.
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Re: Buddy Box Question

Post by unlucky58 »

It is a signal strength problem. I used the diagram from McKenzie in this post on Feb 20, 2014.
Using a JR radio as a trainee's radio with a 9X
I don't seem to have as much servo movement when the JR is in control as when the 9X is master. I just tested a little bit on the bench. Have not actually tried to control an actual plane at this time. Will update if and when I do.
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jhsa
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Re: Buddy Box Question

Post by jhsa »

Other radios normally don't allow as much control as the custom firmware.. try using the multiplier if you need more control..

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Re: Buddy Box Question

Post by rdeanchurch »

I've got a friends TX trying to buddy box to a Taranis (A) Taranis master (V2.0.12OpenTX) 9x slave.
I put 813 firmware on his TH9X with SmartieParts board.

I still don;t see PPMSIM in protocols. No movement on any channel Trainer page of Taranis.

I must be missing something. Cable is good, it works with a JR 9303 as slave.

What am I doing wrond?
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MikeB
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Re: Buddy Box Question

Post by MikeB »

You need to enable PPMSIM in the RADIO SETUP (Controls) before it appears in the list of protocols.

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Re: Buddy Box Question

Post by rdeanchurch »

O.K. I see where it needs a check mark.

Thnk you, Mike
Dean

done
As expected, it all works now....Thanks again.
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unlucky58
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Re: Buddy Box Question

Post by unlucky58 »

I finally got the circuit built to boost the signal from the JR to the 9X and started testing on the plane I want this to work on. The ER9X now recognizes the signal. I centered the sticks on the JR and calibrated the 9X with the menu button. However, I still have a problem. The throttle will open but then closes back when the JR is in control with the trainer switch pulled. The throttle on the 9X is set to channel 1 to match the JR transmitter. It always does this. Any ideas?
unlucky58
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Re: Buddy Box Question

Post by unlucky58 »

Let me make what is happening more clear. It was clear to me but maybe not to everyone else.

9X is master radio. JR is trainer.

9X as master.

9X at low stick throttle (carb is closed).
9X high stick throttle ( carb is fully opened).

Flip the trainer switch for JR to take over.

Low stick throttle (carb is closed).
High stick throttle (carb opens almost full then closes right after it reaches open. Stick is remains at high.)
unlucky58
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Re: Buddy Box Question

Post by unlucky58 »

New discovery. Even though I have the trainer menu mode set to := the 9X still has control even with the trainer switch thrown. That is why the throttle returned closed. The JR was full open throttle but I had the 9X throttle closed. Is that normal? If so, then I guess I don't have a problem. I was expecting the JR to have the only control with it set to :=.
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MikeB
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Re: Buddy Box Question

Post by MikeB »

Each model has a trainer enable option in it. If that is set to OFF, then the trainer operation, as configured on the trainer menu, is disabled.

In the main MODEL SETUP menu, look for "Trainer".

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unlucky58
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Re: Buddy Box Question

Post by unlucky58 »

Under Model setup page 1 trainer option is set to ON.
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MikeB
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Re: Buddy Box Question

Post by MikeB »

Do you only have a problem with the throttle? Do the other channels work OK?

There is a test in the firmware that validates the trainer input. If, for some reason, the trainer input signal becomes invalid or missing, then, regardless of whether the trainer switch is active, control reverts to the master Tx.
One of the tests is to check the width of each pulse coming in. The limits used are 0.8 mS and 2.2mS, so if a pulse is longer than 2.2mS, then the trainer input is considered to be invalid.

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unlucky58
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Re: Buddy Box Question

Post by unlucky58 »

Mike, All 4 channels act the same way. It is not just the throttle.
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MikeB
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Re: Buddy Box Question

Post by MikeB »

So, please confirm what you see. I understand that if you pull the trainer switch control is passed to the JR, but if you move any JR control close to one end then control reverts to the 9X. Is this correct?

If so, please monitor the CAL values on the TRAINER menu. Try the aileron. I assume it starts at 0, with the JR stick centered. As you move the stick so the value increases, does it go past 100? If so, how far past?

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unlucky58
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Re: Buddy Box Question

Post by unlucky58 »

Yes, control reverts back to the 9X I'm still testing some things. If I figure anything out I'll update.

Mike, Using the aileron I get the following:

full left stick center stick full right stick
79.6 0 -73.6
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MikeB
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Re: Buddy Box Question

Post by MikeB »

So does the JR control the servo around the centre, but control reverts to the 9X when the JR gets near the end(s)?
If you bring the JR back to the centre, does control go back to the JR?

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jhsa
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Re: Buddy Box Question

Post by jhsa »

Mike, could it be that the signal is still too low?

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Re: Buddy Box Question

Post by unlucky58 »

Mike, Yes, the JR controls the throttle servo from low stick to about 2/3's throttle and it has total control. Once above 2/3's throttle on the JR then it reverts back to the 9X and will stay with the 9X until the JR's throttle is dropped back to 2/3's or less. Once the control is reverted back to the 9X the 9X has control of all 4 channels. Once the throttle is dropped back on the JR then the JR resumes control of all 4 channels.
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MikeB
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Re: Buddy Box Question

Post by MikeB »

OK, is it only the throttle stick on the JR that causes the loss of control, or do any of the other sticks cause it?
You gave me the CAL values, in the trainer menu, for the aileron stick, what does the CAL value for the throttle stick do?

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Re: Buddy Box Question

Post by unlucky58 »

Mike, Yes, it is only the throttle stick that causes the problem. I tried calibrating in the trainer with the throttle at half stick and at low stick the anomaly happens either way but below are the readings for both.

Calibrated at half stick

low center high
79.2 0 -43.4

Calibrated at low stick

low center high
0 -78.2 -120.8
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MikeB
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Re: Buddy Box Question

Post by MikeB »

This is a very odd problem, so I'm trying to work out exactly what might be going wrong.
So, two more questions.
1. Does the throttle CAL value change over the full range of the JR stick, or does it stop changing around the point control passes back to the 9X?
2. With the JR throttle in a position where control has passed back to the 9X, does moving the aileron stick affect the aileron CAL value?

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unlucky58
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Re: Buddy Box Question

Post by unlucky58 »

Mike

1. Does the throttle CAL value change over the full range of the JR stick, or does it stop changing around the point control passes back to the 9X? It stops changing.

2. With the JR throttle in a position where control has passed back to the 9X, does moving the aileron stick affect the aileron CAL value? Yes the CAL value continues to change.

I decided to try another JR radio and see what would happen. I tried a JR 8103 as the trainer and did not have the problem. It just shows up when I use the JR F400. Looks like it could be something with the F400 causing the problem.
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Re: Buddy Box Question

Post by Daedalus66 »

The 400 is noted for buddy box compatibility problems, even with other JR transmitters!
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Re: Buddy Box Question (Me TOO!)

Post by boowho »

Have two 9X, both running the same version of er9x. (835)

Everything works fine except that my collective pitch on channel 6 has only a fraction of the "throw" when being controlled from the student TX, as opposed to a when being controlled from the instructor TX.

Attached are two screen snaps of the pertinent eePe windows. I should add that TRAINER mode is set in the Inst TX for the specific model. The channels I need on the student TX are:

1 - AIL
2 - ELE
3 - THR
4 - RUD
6 - collective pitch.

One final note, the channel order for the trainer window (pic2) is different from what shows in the corresponding window on the TX. I suspect this may simply be a "bug" either in eepe or er9x (that they don't match).
pic1.png
pic2.png
Thanks

Boowho

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