Orange Module running MULTI protocol

Choosing an RF Module? What modules work? What is compatible with the 9x?
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Re: Orange Module running MULTI protocol

Post by MikeB »

I did use the "RAW" input for the 3.3V from the module. This feeds the 'Mini's 5V regulator (allowing 9-10V as the supply), so you get a small voltage drop through that. Using VCC should work OK, you just avoid that voltage drop. I used the "RAW" input so if I made a mistake and connected a higher voltage, the regulator prevented any damage!

Good progress I see.

A note: The 4 programming pads/vias are quite small, so are not mechanically strong. Try to avoid putting any strain on the 4 wires. I managed to pull one of the pads off one of my boards, but I had soldered wires on and removed them several times before that happened. Now, with the bootloader, we only need to add the wires once.

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Re: Orange Module running MULTI protocol

Post by ShowMaster »

Thanks guys, I'm enjoying the adventure ,improvising, education.
Using the uno with its chip removed to program the pro mini was really helpful.
My ftdi programmer is still in transit from china.
Thanks for the orange pad warning Mike.
I'll be careful removing the wires and not pull UP on them but instead sideways when I remove them.
That or just cut off the wires at the pads.

Another clarification please,
This picture is how it's suggested to connect the 2 boards.

Image

I was confused about the mini GRN connection to the uno reset. I saw this very tiny pad marked GRN and did some more searches.
I found where one person used the DTR pin for the uno reset connection instead of the GRN pad?
It seems to work ok, but since I'm learning, I'll ask about it. The mini schematic does show the DTR pin can do a reset if pulled to ground.
Image

Picture of my mini boards pad pinout. I've added the 90 deg male header to the pads.

I haven't traced the tiny GRN pad to see where it goes but I will tonight to be better aquatinted with the board ca the schematic.
I don't see a GRN on the schematic?

Image





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Orange Module running MULTI protocol

Post by ShowMaster »

jhsa wrote:Yes, the 5V 16Mhz arduino should work. Connect the 3.3V from the Orange module to the "VCC" pin of the arduino..

João



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Thank you for your help. You and Mike keep me motivated with your replies. I'm also posting my progress and any success or failures to help sort out any questions on what works.



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Re: Orange Module running MULTI protocol

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Comment deleted due to inaccurate information
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Re: Orange Module running MULTI protocol

Post by MikeB »

I don't recognise that "GRN" connection, nor do I recognise the order of the connections shown on the Pro Mini connecting to the UNO.
My Pro Minis have the same connections as the one in your picture.
Connect the RESET from the UNO to DTR.

For info, the bootloader in the Pro Mini runs for a short time after power on/reset, looking for a flashing operation. If not seen, then it runs the loaded application. DTR is therefore used to cause a reset and so running the bootloader, just before flashing.
By having it capacitively coupled, the falling edge does the reset, but the reset is not held.
I'm not sure I like the implementation as when the DTR signal goes high, the capacitor has to discharge through the protection diode of the processor on the Pro Mini.

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Re: Orange Module running MULTI protocol

Post by ShowMaster »

I'll ohm out my board and see if the tiny GRN pad actually goes anywhere?
I just haven't found a mini schematic showing a GRN reference on it yet?
It would seem that if I had a ftdi programmer it would use the DTR pin because it's an actual pad with a hole in it. Tutorials usually show the ftdi pins just pushed into the mini one end pad holes where I have a DTR pin pad.
My ftdi is on its way from china and I didn't want to wait. So the uno method is filling for now.
I really was interested in the orange module flashing, but the arduino path required has been fun so far and no smoke yet.
My tech free time lately has been an hour or 2 every few days. That slows the process down. It does give me time to read up and make plans however.

Thanks


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Orange Module running MULTI protocol

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Moved
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Re: Orange Module running MULTI protocol

Post by MikeB »

External module is the module bay. Internal module is the in-built XJT for FrSky radios, or the internal connections for SKY/AR9X/9XR-PRO/9Xtreme.

The PDI sketch should flash the LED after it has run, slowly (once per second) if the PDI flashing worked OK, fast (5 times per second) if the PDI flashing failed, so with nothing connected it will flash fast.
I suggest using the files from "MultiOrangeP1_1_6_22.zip" in the first post of the thread, choose green or blue to match your Orange module.
When you do an "Update Multi" operation from ersky9x, you should get a result screen showing if the operation was successful.

After flashing the module, power up the radio normally. Try the following:
Set the external module to disabled. Look at the LED on the module, it should be flashing. This indicates the firmware in it is running, but it is NOT seeing any data from the radio.
Check in the Telemetry menu you have COM1 selected and it is NOT inverted.
Set the external module to "Multi", leave the protocol as FLYSKY. The LED on the module should be mostly on, but flash off briefly.
If the telemetry connection is OK, you should also see "N/A" flashing beside the FLYSKY text. Further down the protocol menu, beside the BIND option, you should see the frimware revision of the module firmware (1.1.6.22).

If that is OK, we'll move on to DSM binding.

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Re: Orange Module running MULTI protocol

Post by ShowMaster »

Thank you for your patience and help again Mike.
I'm at a RC event today and will give this a try tonight.



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Orange Module running MULTI protocol

Post by ShowMaster »

Rereading you info I see where you say I should select flysky. That alone is a great help as I missed that and set it to dsm.
I'll check all your steps.
Thanks for the led flash info on the multi.
Being that I was able to upload blink and change the speed, I'm pretty sure I uploaded the bootloader sketch ok as well.
You did mention that the 5v mini may be too fast but it's only needed to work once on the orange board.
Is there anyway I can tell if the bootloader loaded or will the final flash from the 9XR pro be the only way I'll know if the module was updated when I see it on the screen and test it?

I was outside at our field all day and may fall asleep at the computer tonight. Great weather today.
I'll report back if I stay awake. If not it may be tomorrow.
I'm really determined to make this work now.






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Re: Orange Module running MULTI protocol

Post by ShowMaster »

Eclipse mania is over and I have time to devote to starting from scratch and getting it correct.

Right off I hit a wall.
I'm using a uno with its may removed
as mentioned while waiting for my ftdi.
I'm using a 5v pro mini clone. Loading in the test blink sketch and modifying its blink rate works so I think my programmer setup is ok.
I've tried both the pdi and pdimini sketches in the PdiMulti zip folder and the mini led flashes rapidly, certainty not once per second?
I'm assuming I want to use the PdiMini.ino sketch and not just the Pdi one?
It would seem I'm stuck at phase one of the multi flashing steps?
Not having a great knowledge of the sketch code, I do see the led flash values at the end of the pdimini sketch.
In case#10 I see a delay value of 500 and in case#11 a delay value of 100?
Aren't these values too small for a 1 second flash rate?

If I can get past this stage knowing the correct pdi sketch was loaded successfully, I can move on.
I'm really focused and been studying as much as I can without asking for help, but help!
Thanks as always.






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Re: Orange Module running MULTI protocol

Post by MikeB »

Yes you want the PdiMini sketch.
The fast flashing (5 times per second) is correct if you run the sketch when not connected to the Orange module, it indicates a failure to flash, which is correct since it doesn't have anything to flash!
You get the slow flashing when it is connected to the Orange module and flashes it correctly.

case 10 is for success and is 500mS on and 500mS off, so 1 flash per second.
case 11 is for failure and is 100mS on and 100mS off, so 5 flashes per second.

It looks like you have the Pro Mini correctly flashed, so the next step is to connect it to the Orange module and power up the module, then you expect the slow flashing.

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Re: Orange Module running MULTI protocol

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Got real close this time. I have another original module to try, and one newer if it's decided I messed this one up. Got the process down pretty good now as well as a pro mini with the bootloader.

From your notes Mike

The PDI sketch should flash the LED after it has run, slowly (once per second) if the PDI flashing worked OK, fast (5 times per second) if the PDI flashing failed, so with nothing connected it will flash fast.

(Got the 1 sec flash after loading the PDI mini sketch. Ok)


I suggest using the files from "MultiOrangeP1_1_6_22.zip" in the first post of the thread, choose green or blue to match your Orange module.
When you do an "Update Multi" operation from ersky9x, you should get a result screen showing if the operation was successful.

(Used the blue version MultiOtange and saw the progress bar move slowly on the Maint menu screen. OK)

After flashing the module, power up the radio normally. Try the following:
Set the external module to disabled. Look at the LED on the module, it should be flashing. This indicates the firmware in it is running, but it is NOT seeing any data from the radio.

(Ok)

Check in the Telemetry menu you have COM1 selected and it is NOT inverted.

(Com 1 selected and set to none. I'm assuming that's OK)


Set the external module to "Multi", leave the protocol as FLYSKY. The LED on the module should be mostly on, but flash off briefly.
If the telemetry connection is OK,

(When I selected Multi the led flashing went from rapid to mostly on.
OK)

you should also see "N/A" flashing beside the FLYSKY text. Further down the protocol menu, beside the BIND option, you should see the frimware revision of the module firmware (1.1.6.22).

(This I don't see?)





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Re: Orange Module running MULTI protocol

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A few setbacks maybe, but I'm hanging going in there.
So once again, a few more questions.
After loading the latest ersky9xP fw, I now see a internal and external module menu choice. To be sure, which one do I use?
I turned both to on?
I verified via Arduino IDE that I could load in blink sketch into my mini and modify and reload the blink rate.
I then loaded in the PiD sketch. I'm not sure how to verify it loaded correctly?
Is there any led action associated with the sketch I should look for?
I then tried a bootloader flash into the orange module via the pro maintenance mode. I'm not sure I saw a quick flash bar, but I didn't get any timeout indication. I'm assuming the pro port was outputting data.

I then tried a dsmx bind operation but it didn't happen.

What I didn't do first with the orange module is test they it bound in its original state. I'm using one of the 2 original defective fw green board modules I have for now. They did work but had the ch 2 timing issue.

To start from scratch, I need to know the pro settings to use a stock ppm orange module first to verify it's working? I have one test version not used yet as I posted.

Then try the mini and orange flashing again hopefully it can be done on the one I'm using a second time?

If possible Mike or others, could you please refine and post in order for a green board, the exact file names I want to use (many are posted)?

The mini sketch is by itself and I think I'm ok on that.

The pro menu setting I want for the module port.
The files I want to load to the SD card.

If I'm successful I'll try a newer blue board orange module I'm saving.

I'll also be doing a green board very new orange module as a final flash for my friend.

I'm hoping I can flash the bootloader into the orange module several times to get it correct?

Sorry for the bother, but I'm determined to make this happen now! I need to know where I'm messing up.

I could try the 3.3v mini if the speed is better matched?

I also picked up an interesting mini pro.
It has the ftdi to mini USB circuitry and connector on board for programming. No external ftdi board required. Slightly larger footprint however.





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Re: Orange Module running MULTI protocol

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Got real close this time. I have another original module to try, and one newer if it's decided I messed this one up. Got the process down pretty good now as well as a pro mini with the bootloader.

From your notes Mike

The PDI sketch should flash the LED after it has run, slowly (once per second) if the PDI flashing worked OK, fast (5 times per second) if the PDI flashing failed, so with nothing connected it will flash fast.

(Got the 1 sec flash after loading the PDI mini sketch. Ok)


I suggest using the files from "MultiOrangeP1_1_6_22.zip" in the first post of the thread, choose green or blue to match your Orange module.
When you do an "Update Multi" operation from ersky9x, you should get a result screen showing if the operation was successful.

(Used the blue version MultiOtange and saw the progress bar move slowly on the Maint menu screen. OK)

After flashing the module, power up the radio normally. Try the following:
Set the external module to disabled. Look at the LED on the module, it should be flashing. This indicates the firmware in it is running, but it is NOT seeing any data from the radio.

(Ok)

Check in the Telemetry menu you have COM1 selected and it is NOT inverted.

(Com 1 selected and set to none. I'm assuming that's OK)


Set the external module to "Multi", leave the protocol as FLYSKY. The LED on the module should be mostly on, but flash off briefly.
If the telemetry connection is OK,

(When I selected Multi the led flashing went from rapid to mostly on.
OK)

you should also see "N/A" flashing beside the FLYSKY text. Further down the protocol menu, beside the BIND option, you should see the frimware revision of the module firmware (1.1.6.22).

(This I don't see?)



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Re: Orange Module running MULTI protocol

Post by MikeB »

Looks like all the firmware flashing is fine, and the hardware serial connections must be OK or the flashing from maintenance mode would not have worked.
What you are not getting is the telemetry/status data from the module.
With everything as you last had it (Multi/FLYSKY selected and the LED on the module just blinking off occasionally), go UP LONG, then RIGHT about 7 times to get to the DEBUG screen. On the bottom line of the screen you should have "TelRxCount", followed by 2 (hex) numbers. The first is a count of the number of bytes received, and should be counting up, the second is the telemetry settings, I'd like to know what value you have there, I'd expect 0700.

What radio are you using for this?

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Orange Module running MULTI protocol

Post by ShowMaster »



Im using the last HK beta board 9XR pro Mike. It seemed like the most direct path without requiring a buffer.

As far as I can remember on our pro's, we changed a resistor value to increase the audio level. We also did some changes on the trainer jack board to allow the futaba connecter to be used for the djt telemetry no solder interface cable.
Other than that I think the tx is the same as the retail release version.
It was working with old fw, and I can verify that again with the new fw and with a stock djt module using the telemetry interface cable.
I have a stock working xjt module in a working g 9Xtreme conversion I've never tried in the pro.
Now that the multi module may be be flashed correctly, maybe try it in the 9Xtreme tx?

I also have a working but needs the latest ersky9x fw, a B and C version skyboard conversion 9X.
At some point all these should be brought up to the latest fw and tested/wired to use the Xjt and multi modules anyway.

I just need some how to advice on those TX's.


The orange module metal RF deck felt slightly warm so I believe it's putting out RF.
I do own a RFexplorer I can check that with. I can't feed it directly into the explorer( no attenuators purchased) but I can check radiated RF.
To be honest, I bought it and it got put on a shelf. I'll need to review its operation but that's what it's for. Good time to learn and use it.
Dedicated thread on it even.

I'm actually enjoying the bench time again that stoped when our beta projects ran out, or mine did.

I'll try and check for the pro values you're asking for and post them asap.
I've left the house already but will return in the afternoon.

I just wanted to give you an inventory of what I have in case you want me to try another tx.

I'm assuming all these values we're looking for are without a receiver involved yet?


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Re: Orange Module running MULTI protocol

Post by MikeB »

I have mine working in the last 'PRO beta Tx. Check the Real Time Clock is running and the battery hasn't gone flat. The inverter for the telemetry input is controlled from an output of the RTC chip, and doesn't work properly if the RTC battery is flat. If the RTC battery is flat, change the INVERT COM setting to 1 and back to NONE and it should then set the inverter correctly until you power off.

Yes, you don't need a receiver yet. The module sends some status data all the time.

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Re: Orange Module running MULTI protocol

Post by ShowMaster »

Had a few min back at home.
Rtc seems so show the correct date and the time is one hour fast, never set for dst.
Tried setting com 1 to 1 invert and then back to none.
Doing that the debug screen now show a 0001 and 0700 now
Image
Before doing the com1 reset I saw this

Image

I see this on the protocol screen
Image

I've got to run again, but I'll be back later today to try anything you can think of.
Sorry for the trouble.



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Re: Orange Module running MULTI protocol

Post by MikeB »

No data arriving on COM 1.
I'll ask you to check the wire you added from the processor pin to the bottom pin of the module connector is still connecting OK.

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Re: Orange Module running MULTI protocol

Post by ShowMaster »

I had the same thought after reading your helpful tips.
I'm pretty sure the wire and trace cut is ok, but a recheck tonight will verify that.
One fear I have is with all I was doing at first, I could have connected to that added wire with some other lead?
If it gets down to "it should be working" I'll carefully try the second module.
Nothing going to stop success if I can help it!
Later tonight I'll get back to it.



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Re: Orange Module running MULTI protocol

Post by ShowMaster »

Ran out of free time tonight. Going for the morning.
A orange mcu question. If it turns out the telemetry wire is ok and it's more like I damaged mcu, can that be replaced and just flash the bootloader and orange multi again?
I should be ok replacing it as I have chip quick and the microscope, and have had success in the past.
It's more about the journey to success now.
What I can't figure out is now that I've fully retired, why don't I seem to have any free time? When I was working full time I had so much free time ha ha.







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Re: Orange Module running MULTI protocol

Post by MikeB »

Repeating the "maintenance mode" operation to "Update Multi" on the module should check the wire is still connected OK. My, "it should work" is based on having used that method to flash the module, everything should be connected, so the chip should also be working OK.

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Re: Orange Module running MULTI protocol

Post by ShowMaster »

Looks like a damaged it Mike, it failed the test.
I think I know when it happened thinking back.
Taking a short cut from your advice to install the flashed module board back into its case, I instead plugged just the board into the pro.
I discovered but late, that I plugged it in one pin off from the bottom pro pin 5. This moved all pins up one pin with pin 1 not connected.
I didn't think I had the external port turned on but must be yes, ugh!
I shouldn't have tried it so late in the night.

The actual programming process steps as you detailed them did work, so I'll try again with another module, but rested!
Hurts to tell the truth, but one should in these situations.








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Re: Orange Module running MULTI protocol

Post by MikeB »

I've managed to plug a Multi module in like that, but it survived OK. On the 'blue' board, that will put battery voltage on the ground connection and connect ground to the signal with the added wire on it. That, I think, forward biases one of the protection diodes in the processor, so it has very likely damaged that processor pin. Possibly, if you have another 'blue' board, include a resistor (470 ohms to 1K) in the added wire connection, to limit the current in this situation (hindsight is wonderful!).

Replacing the processor is likely to work, but there may be a problem with the fuses needing to be set.

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Re: Orange Module running MULTI protocol

Post by ShowMaster »

Yes, stuff happens. I'm sure it was working and I killed it!
No time to blink now, got to push on with another module!
Next time I'll put the board back in its case or use a 5pin male extension cable that I know is inserted correctly.
I was trying to avoid removing the 4 soldered on wires used to load the bin program.
Great idea until it wasn't!

Not to drag this out but to learn, would be involved if fuses had to be set on a new mcu if that's something your familiar with?

Obviously no longer part of this diy, but some may end up in my situation.

To the lab!








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Orange Module running MULTI protocol

Post by ShowMaster »

Success with a new module but with questions.
I was able to bind to my umx receiver Pitts plane with the dsmx-22 ms setting.
I'm seeing a rssi (28-30) from it that stops and then goes to 0 when I disconnect the receiver lipo.

At least it's working now, yea!

What's the channel order I want?
They all seem to be mixed up on my umx pits. Elevator controls throttle for instance.

I went for taer mode 2 but it's not helping.
Actually I also need some operating/settings guidance at this point.
That and a range check.

Selecting the protocol 1st channel as a 2 does make ail and el ok but I lose rudder and throttle?

Mike, your PDF shows rate #'s & ms to set for how many channels used.
I see a 7 at the end or above of I think the bind option line (from my memory, called it a night) that goes from 7 up a few numbers if set?






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Re: Orange Module running MULTI protocol

Post by jhsa »

Try AETR. The multi code might convert it to TAER..

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Re: Orange Module running MULTI protocol

Post by ShowMaster »

I'll give that ch order a try.
I had to work on another project and wow, 1Am already. I'll have time again after some sleep.
While I was trying some settings, I was able to control 2 ch and move them around to see all 4, 2 at a time work. I'm assuming it's a frame or timing setting if not channel order.
Not much help out there on the stock module ch setting requirements a quick search turned up.

I'll sleep on it and maybe try a real Spektrum receiver with my OScope.
Then I can see what's going on. I can't take the prop off easily on my umx test plane and it sometimes without warning startup as I try settings.




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Re: Orange Module running MULTI protocol

Post by jhsa »

As I said, the multiprotocol (that you have now installed in the module) sometimes changes the channel order to match the original system. The default channel order for the multiprotocol code, if you didn't change it, is AETR. So, please try that before you mess with scopes, it might save you some work and valuable time ;) :D

João
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https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL5uJhoD7sAKidZmkhMpYpp_qcuIqJXhb9

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